克里希那穆提 - 思想和时间是恐惧的根源

Krishnamurti Subtitles

AM81T1 - 思想和时间是恐惧的根源
第一次公开讲话
荷兰，阿姆斯特丹
1981年9月19日

1:30	Most unfortunately there are only two talks and so we have to condense what we have to say about the whole existence of life. We are not doing any kind of propaganda, we are not persuading you to think in one particular direction, nor convince you about anything. We must be quite sure of that. We are not bringing something exotic from the East, all that nonsense that goes on in the name of the gurus and those people who write strange things after visiting India. We do not belong to that crowd at all. But we would like to point out that during these two talks that we are thinking together, not merely listening to the talks, listening to some ideas, either agreeing or disagreeing with those ideas, we are not creating any kind of arguments, opinions, judgements, but together – I mean together, you and the speaker, are going to observe what the world has become, not only in the Western world but also in the East where there is a great deal of poverty, great misery, an enormous amount of population, where the politicians, as here in the West, are incapable of dealing with what is happening. They are all politicians thinking in terms of tribalism. Tribalism has become the glorified nationalism. And we cannot therefore rely on any politicians, or on any leader, or on any books that have been written about religion. We cannot possibly rely on any of these people, neither the scientists, nor the biologists, nor the psychologists. They have not been able to solve our human problems. I am quite sure you agree to all that. Nor can we rely on any of the gurus. Unfortunately these people come to the West and exploit people, get very rich, and they have nothing whatsoever to do with religion.	非常不幸，我们只有两次谈话。因此我们必须浓缩我们所要谈论的关于整个生命存在的话题。我们并非在做任何形式的宣传，我们无意劝导你朝着特定的方向思考，也无意说服你去相信任何东西。我们必须非常清楚这一点。我们不是要介绍来自东方的异国情调，所有那些打着大师名号的胡言乱语以及那些作者在拜访印度后所写的奇谈怪论。我们完全不属于那个群体。我们要指出的是在这两次谈话中我们是在一起思考，而不只是在听听这些谈话，听到某些理念，然后去认同或不认同这些理念。我们不是在提出任何一种辩词、意见、判断，而是一同——我是说，一同，你和讲话者一同——去观察世界的变化，不只在西方世界，在东方世界也一样，存在巨大的贫苦、灾难、庞大的人口，那些政治人物——就像在西方世界一样—— 都无法应对所发生的一切。他们都是政客，依照部落主义的方式在思考。部落主义已经变成光辉的民族主义，因此我们已经不能信赖任何政客，或任何领导者，或任何关于宗教的书籍，我们不可能去依赖这些中的任何一个，任何科学家、生物学家，任何心理学家。他们一直都未能解决我们人类的问题。我非常肯定你们都认同这一点。我们也不能依赖任何大师。不幸的是，这些人却来到西方剥削人们而成为巨富，但他们完全与宗教无关。
5:48	Having said all that, it is important that we, you and the speaker, think together. We mean by thinking together, not merely accepting any kind of opinion or evaluation but together observe not only externally – that is, what is happening in the world – but also what is happening to all of us inwardly, psychologically. Externally, outwardly there is great uncertainty, confusion, wars, or the threat of war. There are wars going on in some parts of the world, human beings are killing each other. That is not happening in the West, here, but there is the threat of the nuclear war, the bomb, and the preparation for war. And we ordinary human beings do not seem to be able to do anything about all that. There are demonstrations, terrorism, hunger strikes and so on. This is what is actually going on in the outward world; one tribal group against another tribal group; the West, America against another country and so on. The scientists are contributing to all that, and the philosophers, though they may talk against all that but inwardly they continue in terms of nationalism, according to their own particular career and so on. So that is what is actually going on in the outward world, of which any intelligent human being can observe.	说了所有这些之后，重要的是我们，你和讲话者，一同去思考。我们所说的一同思考，并非只是接受任何意见或评价，而是一同去观察——不只是外在的，也就是那些世界上正在发生的事，同样也包括发生在我们所有人内在的、心理上的事情。外部世界，从外在来看，有着巨大的不确定性、混乱、战争，或战争的威胁。战争正发生在世界的某处，人类正在互相残杀。这没发生在西方世界，没发生在这里，但却隐藏着威胁——核战争的威胁，核弹，以及战争的筹备。而我们普通人却好像完全不能对这一切做些什么。我们有示威行动，恐怖活动，绝食斗争，等等。这是外在世界真实发生的事情；一个部落群体对抗另一个部落群体；西方——美国——对抗另一个国家，等等。那些科学家助长了这一切，而那些哲学家——虽然他们口头上反对这一切，但内在，他们却根据自己特定的经历等等，继续着国家主义的方式。所以那就是外在世界真实发生的事情，这一切，任何一个聪明人都能看出来。
8:59	And inwardly, in our own minds and in our own hearts, we are also very confused. There is no security, not only perhaps for ourselves but for our future, our future generation. Religions have divided human beings as the Christian, the Hindus, the Muslims and the Buddhists and so on.	而内在，在我们的头脑和我们的心灵中，我们同样也是非常混乱的。我们没有安全感，也许不只是对自身没有安全感，也包括对我们的未来，对我们的下一代。宗教已经把人类分割成基督教徒，印度教徒，伊斯兰教徒以及佛教徒等等。
9:50	So considering all this, looking objectively, calmly, without any prejudice, observing, it is naturally important that we think about all this together. Think together. Not have opinions opposing another set of opinions; or one conclusion against another conclusion, one ideal against another ideal; but rather think together and see what we human beings can do. The crisis is not in the economic world nor in the political world, but the crisis is in our consciousness. I think very few of us realise that. The crisis is in our mind and in our heart. That is, the crisis is in our consciousness. Our consciousness, which is our whole existence, with our beliefs, with our conclusions, with our nationalism, with all the fears that one has, the pleasures, the apparently insoluble problem of sorrow, the thing that we call love, compassion, and the problem of death, and what is there, if there is anything hereafter, and the question of meditation, and if there is anything beyond time, beyond thought, if there is something eternal. That is the content of our consciousness. That is the content of every human being, whether they live in this country or in Asia, in India or in America or Russia. The content of our consciousness is the common ground of all humanity. I think this must be made very clear right from the beginning.	所以思考这一切，客观地、平静地观察，没有任何偏见，只是去观察，很自然，重要的是我们必须一同去思考这一切。一同思考，并非以一套观点去反对另一套观点；或者用一个结论去对抗另一个结论，一个理想去对抗另一个理想；而是一同思考并看清我们人类到底能够做些什么。危机不在经济世界里，也不在政治世界里，而在我们的意识中。我相信很少人觉悟到这一点。危机在我们脑中以及我们心中。也就是说，危机在我们意识中。我们的意识——它是我们的整个存在，包含我们的信仰，我们的结论，我们的民族主义，我们全部的恐惧，我们的乐趣，那似乎无法解决的悲伤问题，那个我们称为爱和慈悲的东西，以及死亡的问题，死后会有什么——如果死后还有什么存在的话—— 还有那些关于冥想的问题，以及到底有没有超越时间、超越思想的东西，是否存在某种永恒之物。那就是我们意识的内容。那是每个人的内容，无论他们居住在这里还是亚洲，居住在印度、美国还是俄罗斯。我们意识的内容是全人类基本的共同点。我认为这一点从一开始就必须澄清。
13:47	As a human being living in this part of the world, he suffers, not only physically but also inwardly. He is anxious, uncertain, fearful, confused, anxious, without any sense of deep security. It is the same in Asia, with every human being there, it is the same in India, it is the same in America and Russia. So our consciousness is common to all mankind. Please do listen to this. You may be hearing this for the first time and so please don’t discard it. Let’s investigate it together, let’s think about it together. Not when you get home but now. That your consciousness – what you think, what you feel, your reactions, your anxiety, your loneliness, your sorrow, your pain, the search for something that is not merely physical but goes beyond all thought – is the same as a person living in India or Russia or America. They go through the same problems as you do, the same problems of relationship with each other, man, woman. So we are all standing on the same ground - consciousness. Our consciousness is common to all of us. And therefore we are not individuals. Please do consider this. We have been trained, educated, religiously as well as scholastically, that we are separate souls, individuals, striving for ourselves, but that is an illusion because our consciousness is common to all mankind. So we are mankind. We are not separate individuals fighting for ourselves. This is logical, this is rational, sane. So we are not separate entities with separate psychological content struggling for ourselves. But we are, each one of us is actually the rest of human kind.	作为一个人，活在这个世界的角落，他受苦受难，不仅在身体上，内心也是如此。他焦虑、不确定、恐惧、困惑、担忧，没有任何深度的安全感。在亚洲也是一样，包括那里的每一个人，在印度也一样，在美国和俄罗斯也是如此。因此我们的意识是全人类共同的意识。请你们仔细听清楚这一点。你们可能是首次听到这种说法，所以请不要把它就此抛弃。让我们一同去探讨它，让我们一同去思考它 ——不是当你回家后，而是现在。也就是你的意识，你所思，你所感，你的反应，你的焦虑，你的寂寞，你的悲哀，你的痛楚，以及你对某种不只是物质的而是超越所有思维之物的追寻。你与生活在印度、俄罗斯或者美国的人是一样的。他们经历同样的问题，正如你一样，彼此之间有同样的人际关系问题，男人和女人的关系。所以我们都站在同一个基础上——意识。我们的意识是我们共有的。所以我们并非个人。请真的思考一下这点。我们在宗教上，在学校里被培养和教育，他们说我们是单独的灵魂和个体，为自己而奋斗，但这只是一个幻觉，因为我们的意识是全人类共有的。所以我们就是全人类。我们不是只为自己而奋斗的分离个体。这是符合逻辑的、合理的、明智的。所以我们不是分离的实体带着各自的心理内容，为自己奋斗。我们，我们每一个人，事实上就是其他的人类。
17:57	So logically, perhaps you will accept it intellectually, but if you feel that profoundly, then our whole activity undergoes a radical change. That is the first issue that we have to think together about: that our consciousness, the way we think, the way we live, perhaps more comfortably, affluently, with greater facility to travel and so on, apart from that, inwardly, psychologically, you are exactly similar to those who live thousands and thousands of miles away.	因此在逻辑上，你可能会理智地接受这一点，但如果你能深深地感受到，那我们全部的活动将经历一次彻底的转变。这是第一个我们必须一同思考的课题：那就是我们的意识，我们的思考方式，我们的生活方式，也许更舒服，更富裕，有更高级的旅行的交通工具，等等，但除了这些——内在上、心理上，你还是与居住在千里之外的人们完全一样。
19:19	And so we have to think about these problems together. First, the problem of relationship: All life is relationship, the very existence is to be related. And when you observe what we have done with our relationship with each other, whether it is intimate or not, whether between two human beings, man and woman, in that relationship there is tremendous conflict, struggle - why? Why have human beings, who have lived for over a million years, have not solved this problem of relationship? That is, two people living together without conflict. Apparently we have not solved it. So if we could this morning perhaps for an hour, think together about it. Let’s together observe actually what is that relationship between a man and a woman, because all society is based on relationship. There is no society if there is no relationship, society then becomes an abstraction. So we should together, this morning, consider together what our relationships actually are.	所以我们必须一同思考这个问题。首先是关系的问题：所有的生活都是关系，生存本身就是联系。而当你观察我们如何处理我们与他人的关系——无论那种关系是否亲密，不管它是不是两人之间的关系，男人与女人的关系—— 在那种关系中，有着巨大的冲突和斗争——为什么？为什么我们人类生存了超过百万年，仍然没有解决关系的问题？也就是说，两个人生活在一起而没有冲突，很显然我们未能解决它。因此今天早上，我们是否可以花一个小时，一同去思考它。让我们一同观察究竟什么是关系，一个男人与一个女人之间的关系，因为所有社会都是建立在关系上的。没有关系就没有社会，那样社会就会变成一个抽象的概念。所以今天早上，我们应该一起，共同思考我们的关系事实上是什么。
21:51	If one observes it closely there is conflict between man and woman. The man has his own ideals, his own pursuits, his own ambition, he is always seeking success, to be somebody in the world. And also the woman is struggling, also wanting to be somebody, wanting to fulfil, to become. Each is pursuing his own direction. So it is like two railway lines running parallel but never meeting, perhaps in bed but otherwise, if you observe closely they never meet actually, psychologically, inwardly – why? That is the question. When we ask why, we are always asking for the cause, we think in terms of causation, hoping thereby if we could understand the cause then perhaps we would change the effect. May I ask now – you all understand English I hope. If not I am talking to myself, which is rather absurd. One has not been in this country for ten years but one is glad to be back here again, but if we don’t understand English then I am afraid our communication is not possible. So one hopes that you understand English as clearly as possible. Unfortunately one can speak in French or Italian but that would be equally difficult.	如果我们密切地观察，会发现男女之间有着冲突。男人有他的理想，他本身的追求，他的抱负，他总是寻求成功，想要在世上成名。女的也是一样，不断地奋斗努力，也想成为某号人物，渴望获得成就，渴望成为什么。每一个人都追求自己的方向。所以就好像两条铁轨并排平行却永不相遇，可能在床上相遇，而在其他地方却没有——如果你仔细观察的话，他们从未真正相遇过——心理上，内心上——为什么呢？就是这个问题。当我们问为什么时，我们时常是询问其原因；我们依照因果关系来思考，期望着如果我们能够明白那个原因，那么我们或许就能够改变结果了。请允许我问一下——我希望你们都能听懂英语。如果听不懂，我就是自言自语了——这就很荒谬了。我已经十年没有来过这个国家了，但我很高兴能够再次回到这里，但如果我们听不懂英语，那么恐怕我们之间的交流是不可能的。所以我希望你们听得懂英语，越清楚越好。很不幸，我可以讲法语或意大利语，但那同样也是很困难的。
24:53	So we are asking a very simple but very complex question: why is it that we human beings have not been able to solve this problem of relationship though we have lived on this earth for over millions and millions of years? Is it because each one has his own particular image put together by thought, and our relationship is only based on two images: the image that the man creates about her and the image the woman creates about him? So, we are in this relationship : two images living together. That is a fact. If you observe very closely yourself, if one may point out, you have created an image about her, and she has created a picture, a verbal structure about you, the man. So relationship is between these two images. These images have been put together by thought. And thought is not related to love.	所以我们要问一个非常简单却又非常复杂的问题：为什么我们人类还是未能解决关系的问题——虽然我们已经生存这地球上超过百万年了？是不是因为每个人都有各自特定的意象 ——由思想所拼凑起来的意象，而我们的关系只是建立在这两个意象上；男方为女方所制造的意象和女方为男方所制造的意象？所以，我们实际上所处的这种关系，只是两个意象生活在一起。这是一个事实。如果你仔细观察你自己，如果我可以指出的话，你已经制造了一个关于她的意象，而她也制造了一个关于你这个男人的画面和语言上的结构。所以关系是建立于这两个意象之间的。这两个意象是由思想拼凑起来的。而思想和爱无关。
26:55	Is thought love? All the memories of this relationship with each other, the remembrances, the pictures, the conclusions about each other, are - if one observes closely, without any prejudice - are the product of thought, are the result of various remembrances, experiences, irritations, loneliness. And so our relationship with each other is not love but the image that thought has put together.	思想是爱吗？所有的记忆——关于双方关系的记忆，那些回忆、画面，关于对方的结论，都是——如果我们仔细观察、毫无偏见—— 都是思想的产物，是各种回忆、经验、刺激、独孤的结果。所以我们之间的关系并非是爱，而只是思想所拼凑起来的意象。
28:03	So we have to examine, if we are to understand the actuality of relationship, we have to understand the whole movement of thought because we live by thought, all our actions are based on thought; all the great buildings of the world are put together by thought, all the cathedrals, churches, temples and mosques are put there by thought, constructed by thought. And what is inside all these religious buildings – the inside, the figures, the symbols, the images – are all the inventions of thought. There is no refuting that. So thought has created not only the most marvellous architectural buildings and the contents of those buildings, but also it has created the instruments of war, the bomb, various forms of that bomb. Thought has also put together the surgeon, those marvellous instruments, so delicate in surgery. And also thought has made the carpenter. He must study the wood, the instruments and so on. So thought has done all this. The content of a church and the surgeon, the expert engineer who builds a beautiful bridge, are all the result of thought. There is no refuting that however much one may argue. So one has to examine what is thought, why human beings live on thought, why thought has brought about such chaos in the world – war, lack of relationship with each other, the great capacity of thought with its extraordinary energy. And also what thought has done through millions of years, bringing sorrow for mankind. Please observe this together, let’s examine it together. Don’t let’s oppose what the speaker is saying but let’s examine it, what he is saying together so that we understand what is actually happening to all human beings. We are destroying ourselves.	所以我们必须去审视——如果我们要理解关系的事实，我们就必须理解思想的全部运动，因为我们依赖思想而活，我们所有的行为都是基于思想的；世上所有的伟大建筑物都是由思想拼凑起来的，所有的大教堂、小教堂、庙宇和清真寺是由思想拼凑而成，由思想建造出来。而在所有这些宗教建筑里面的是什么？在里面，那些神像、符号、画像是什么？它们都是思想的发明。这是无可反驳的。所以思想不只建造了最奇妙的建筑物以及那些建筑内部的物品，而且也制造了战争的工具，炸弹，各式各样的炸弹。思想造就了外科医生，神奇的手术用具——手术中如此精细的用具。思想也造就了木匠，他必须研究木材、工具，等等。所以思想制造了这一切。教堂里的物品和外科医生，建造华丽建筑物的工程专家，都是思想的成果。这是无可辩驳的——不管你如何争辩。所以我们必须去审视什么是思想，为什么人类依赖思想而活，为什么思想带来了世间的各种混乱，战争，人与人之间关系的贫乏，思想巨大的能力以及它超常的能量。思想经过了几百万年的所作所为，也带来了全人类的痛苦。请一同来观察，让我们一同去考察。你们不要反对讲话者所说的话，而是一同去考察，一同考察他所说的话，以便大家能够明白全人类身上究竟发生了什么。我们正在毁灭自己。
32:12	So we have to go very carefully into the question of thought. Thought is the response of memory. Memory is not only the remembrance of things past but also thought which projects itself as hope in the future. So thought is the response of memory, memory is knowledge, knowledge is experience. That is, there is experience, from experience there is knowledge, from knowledge there is memory, or remembrance, and from memory you act. So from that action you learn, which is further knowledge. So we live in this cycle – experience, knowledge, memory, thought, action. In this cycle human beings live, always living within the field of knowledge. I hope this is not boring you. If you are bored, I am sorry. If you want something romantic, sentimental, something that pleases you, I hope you won’t listen then. But what we are talking about is very serious. It is not something for the weekend, for a casual listening because we are concerned with the radical change of human consciousness. So we have to think about all this, look together, see if it is possible why human beings who have lived on this earth for so many million years are still as we are. We may have advanced technologically, better communication, better transportation, hygiene and so on, but inwardly we are the same, more or less: unhappy, uncertain, lonely, carrying the burden of sorrow endlessly. And any serious man confronted with this challenge must respond, he can’t take it casually, turn his back on it. That is why this meeting and tomorrow morning’s meeting is very serious because we have to apply our minds and our hearts to find out if it is possible to radically bring about a mutation in our consciousness and therefore in our action and behaviour.	所以我们必须非常小心地探讨思想的问题。思想是记忆的反应。记忆不只是回想过去而已，思想也把自己投射为未来的希望。所以思想是记忆的反应，记忆是知识，知识是经验。也就是说，有经验，从经验中产生了知识，从知识中就产生了记忆，或者回忆，然后你透过记忆来行动。因此通过那种行动你来学习——产生了进一步的知识。所以我们就生活在这种循环中—— 经验，知识，记忆，思想，行动。人类生活在这个循环中，一直生活在知识的领域中。我希望这些没有令你感到无聊。如果你觉得无聊，我感到抱歉。如果你想要一些浪漫的、感性的东西，某些取悦你的东西，那么我希望你不要听下去了。我们正在谈论的是非常严肃的东西。它不是周末的消遣，随便听听而已，因为我们关心的是人类意识的根本转变。所以我们必须思考这一切，一同去观察，看看这是否可能，为什么人类在地球上活了成百上千万年，却依然是老样子。我们也许在技术上取得了进步，更好的通讯，更好的交通，卫生保健等等，但内在，我们或多或少还是和以前一样；不快乐、不确定、孤独，永无止尽地背负着悲伤的重负。而任何面对着这种挑战的认真的人都必然要有所回应，他不能马虎行事，转身离去。这就是为什么这次集会和明天早上的集会是非常严肃的，因为我们必须运用我们的头脑和心灵去发现是否可能从根本上带来一次突变 ——我们意识的突变，因此也就是我们行动和举止中的突变。
35:53	So as we were saying, thought is born of experience, knowledge and so there is nothing whatsoever sacred about thought. It is materialistic, it is a process of matter, thinking. And we have relied on that, on thought to solve all our problems, political, religious, relationship and so on. And our brains, our minds are conditioned, educated to solve problems. Thought has created the problem and then our brains, our minds, are trained to solve problems. If you have an engineering problem you solve it, a problem of disease, one solves it and so on. Our minds are trained to solve problems. These problems are created by thought psychologically, inwardly. You follow what is happening? Thought creates the problem psychologically and the mind is trained to solve problems, so thought, creating the problem, thought then tries to solve the problem. So it is caught in the same old process, a routine. So problems are becoming more and more complex, more and more insoluble. So we must find, if it is at all possible, if there is a different way of approaching this life, not through thought because thought has not solved our problems. On the contrary, thought has brought about greater complexity. We must find if it is possible, or if it is not possible, if there is a different dimension, a different approach to life altogether. And that is why it is important to understand the nature of thought, the nature of our thinking. Our thinking is based on remembrance, remembrance of things past. Which is, thinking about what happened a week ago, thinking about it, modified in the present and projected into the future. This is the movement of our life, which is an actuality. So knowledge has become all important for us but knowledge is never complete. Knowledge about anything is still incomplete, will always be incomplete. Therefore knowledge always goes with ignorance, knowledge always lives within the shadow of ignorance. That is a fact. It is not the speaker’s invention, or conclusion, but that is so.	所以正如我们刚才所说，思想来自经验和知识，因此思想完全没有任何神圣之处。它是物质上的，它是一种物质过程——思考。而我们都在依赖它，依赖思想来解决我们所有的问题，政治问题、宗教问题、关系问题等等。而我们的大脑，我们的心灵被局限了，被教育去解决问题。思想制造了问题，然后我们的大脑、我们的心灵，被训练去解决这些问题。如果你有一个工程上的问题你解决它，有疾病的问题你解决它，等等。我们的头脑被训练着去解决问题。心理上、内在地，这些问题是思想所制造出来的。你跟上正在说的东西了吗？思想从心理上制造了问题，而头脑被训练去解决那些问题，因此，思想制造问题，然后试着去解决那个问题。所以，它被困在同样的旧有过程，一种惯例之中。所以问题变得越来越复杂，越来越无法解决。所以我们必须找出，如果那是可行的，是否有不同的方式来对待生命，不是通过思想，因为思想从来不能解决我们的问题。正相反，思想已经把问题搞得更加复杂。我们要弄清楚到底可不可能，到底有没有一种不同的维度，一种完全不同的对待生命的方式。而这就是为什么理解思想的本质，理解我们思考的本质是那么重要的原因。我们的思考是基于回忆的，对过去事物的回忆。也就是回想一周前发生的事，在此刻思考，对它稍作修改，然后把它投射到未来。这就是我们生活中的运动，它是一个事实。所以知识对于我们已经变成非常重要，但知识却从来不是完整的。不管是关于任何事物的知识，都仍旧是不完整的，并且永远都不会完整。因此知识常与愚昧同行，知识时常活在愚昧的阴影中。这是一个事实。这不是讲话者的发明，或者结论，而它就是如此。
40:11	So, love is not knowledge. Love is not remembrance. Love is not desire or pleasure. Desire, pleasure, remembrance are based on thought. So our relationship with each other, however close, however near, if you look at it closely, is based on remembrance which is thought. So in that relationship actually, though one may say you love your wife or your husband or your girlfriend and so on, it is actually based on remembrance which is thought. Therefore in that there is no love. Would you actually see that fact? Or do we say, ‘What terrible things you are saying. I do love my wife’ – but is that so? Can there be love when there is jealousy, possessiveness, attachment, when each one is pursuing his own particular ambition, greed, envy, direction, like two parallel lines never meeting. Is that love? So one has to enquire if one is to pursue the problem of existence seriously, profoundly, one must examine what is desire. Why human beings have been driven by desire. Can the speaker go on with all this? Sorry, you have to bear this but it is your fault that you are here! And perhaps also the speaker’s! I hope we are thinking together, observing together, as two friends walking along that road and seeing what is around us, not only what is very close, what is immediately perceived, but also what one sees in the distance, because we are taking the journey together, perhaps affectionately, hand in hand, or as two friends, amicable, examining the very complex problem of life in which there is no leader, there is no guru, because when one actually sees that our consciousness is the consciousness of the rest of mankind then we realise we are both the guru and the disciple, the teacher as well as the pupil, because we are all that, it is all in our consciousness. That is a tremendous realisation. So that as one begins to understand oneself deeply one becomes a light to oneself and not depend on anybody, on any book, on any authority, including that of the speaker, so that we are capable of understanding this whole problem of living and be a light to ourselves.	所以，爱不是知识。爱不是回忆。爱不是欲望也不是欢愉。欲望，欢愉，回忆都是基于思想的。所以我们彼此间的关系， ——无论如何亲密，如何靠近——如果你去仔细观察它，都是基于回忆的——回忆就是思想。所以实际上，在这种关系中，你可以说你爱你的妻子或丈夫或你的女友等等，事实上，那是建立于回忆也就是思想上的。所以其中并没有爱。你能够切实地看到这个事实吗？或者你会说， “你在说什么鬼话？我是真的爱我的妻子的？” 但真的是这样么？当有了嫉妒、占有、依赖、当双方追求各自不同的野心，贪欲、妒忌，各走各路，就像两条永不相遇的平行线时，那时还会有爱吗？那是爱吗？所以如果一个人要认真地、深刻地去追踪存在的问题，那么他就必须询问，他必须去审视欲望是什么。为什么人类一直被欲望驱使。讲话者能否继续讲下去？对不起，你们必须忍受这些，但你们来这里是你们自己的错。可能讲话者也有错！我希望我们正在一同思考，一同观察，如同两个朋友走在路上观看着我们周围的事物，不只是近处的，可以立即看到的，也包括我们所能看到的远处的事物。因为我们正在一同旅行，也许是怀着爱，手牵着手，或者像两个朋友，友善地检视着非常复杂的生命问题。在我们之间没有领袖，没有古鲁，因为当我们确实看到我们的意识就是其他人类的意识，那我们就会明白我们既是古鲁也是弟子，既是老师也是学生，因为我们都是那样的，那些东西全在我们的意识中。这是一种巨大的领悟。所以当我们开始深入地了解我们自己，我们就会成为自己的光而无需依赖任何人、任何书籍、任何权威——包括讲话者，那样我们就可以理解整个生活的问题，然后成为自己的光。
45:30	So we must examine together desire, because if desire is love then desire creates problems. Love has no problems, and to understand the nature of love, compassion, with its own intelligence, we must understand together what is desire. Desire has extraordinary vitality, extraordinary persuasion, drive, achievement, and the whole process of becoming, success, is based on desire – desire which makes us compare with each other, imitate, conform. So it is very important in understanding the whole nature of ourselves to understand what desire is, not to suppress it, not to run away from it, not to transcend it, but to understand it, to look at it, to see the whole momentum of it. We can do that together, which doesn’t mean that you are learning from the speaker. The speaker has nothing to teach you. Please realise this. The speaker is merely acting as a mirror in which you can see yourself. And then when you see yourself clearly you can discard the mirror, it has no importance, you can break it up.	所以我们必须一起检视欲望，因为如果欲望是爱，那欲望就会制造问题。爱是没有问题的，而要去理解爱的本质, 慈悲，以及其中的智慧，我们就必须一同去理解什么是欲望。欲望有着非凡的活力、非凡的说服力、推动力和成就，而整个变成、成就的过程，都是基于欲望的。欲望使我们互相比较、模仿、遵从。所以重要的是理解我们自己的全部本质。理解什么是欲望，不是压抑它，不是逃离它，不是去超越它，而是去理解它，去观察它，去看清它的全部动力。我们可以一起来做这件事，这并不意味着你在从讲话者这里学习。讲话者没有什么可教你的。请明白这一点。讲话者只是作为一面镜子，好让你看清你自己。而当你看清自己之后，你可以把镜子抛弃，它已不再重要，你可以把它打碎。
47:48	So to understand desire requires attention, seriousness, it is a very complex problem. Why human beings have lived on this extraordinary energy of desire as the energy of thought. What is the relationship between thought and desire? What is the relationship between desire and will? Because we live a great deal by will. So, what is the movement, the source, the origin of desire? If one observes oneself one sees the origin, the beginning of desire begins with sensation, sensory responses, sensory responses with its contact, sensation, then thought creates the image, at that moment begins desire. Please let’s look at it very closely. One sees something in the window, a robe, a shirt, a car, a scarf, whatever it is - seeing, sensation, then touching it, and then thought saying, ‘If I put that dress or shirt on how nice it will look’ – it creates the image, then begins desire. Right? Do you follow all this? See it for oneself, it is fairly simple. You see something very nice, there is the sensation created through nervous responses, optical response, then thought saying, 'how nice I would look with that dress, or shirt, or coat' or whatever it is, then desire begins. So, the relationship between desire and thought is very close. If there was no thought there would be only sensation - not all the problems created by desire. I hope we are meeting each other.	所以了解欲望需要关注、严肃的态度。它是一个非常复杂的问题。为什么人类要依靠这种非凡的欲望能量而生活 ——比如思想的能量？思想与欲望之间的关系是什么？欲望与意志之间的关系是什么？因为我们很大程度上依靠意志而生活。所以，欲望的活动、源头和起源是什么？如果我们观察自己，我们就会看到那个起源，欲望的起源开始于感觉，感官反应，感官反应开始于接触，感觉，然后思想创造出了一个意象，在那一刻欲望就产生了。请让我们密切地来观察一下它。我们看到橱窗内的某样东西，一件长袍、衬衫、汽车、围巾、任何东西，观看，感觉，触摸它，然后思想说， “如果我穿上这件连衣裙或衬衫，将会是多么的好看”，它创造了那个意象，然后欲望就出现了。对吗？你理解这一切了吗？自己去看一看，这是非常简单的。你看到某个非常美好的东西，然后通过神经反应，就产生了感觉，视觉的反应，然后思想说，如果我穿上那件连衣裙、衬衫或大衣——无论什么——将会是多么好看啊，然后欲望就产生了。所以，欲望与思想之间的关系是非常密切的。如果没有思想，那就只有感觉了，将不会有欲望所制造的所有问题。我希望我们彼此理解了。
51:15	So desire is the quintessence of will. So, thought dominates sensation and creates the urge, the desire to possess. Am I talking to myself, or are you all in it? Perhaps all this may be new to you, but we have to think about all these things together, not as separate individual with his own particular conclusions but together observe all this and be very clear about all this.	所以欲望是意志的精髓。因此，思想支配了感觉并且制造了冲动，想要拥有的渴望。我是在自言自语吗，还是你们都在听？这一切可能对你们来说很新鲜，但我们必须一同去思考这所有的一切，不是作为有着自己特定结论的分离个体，而是一同去观察这一切并且非常清楚地理解这一切。
52:16	So where in relationship thought operates, which is remembrance creating the image about each other, where there is that image created by thought there can be no love. Or where there is desire, sexual or other forms of desire, prevents – because desire is part of thought – prevents love.	所以在关系中思想会运作，也就是记忆创造出了彼此的意象，当有了思想所制造的意象，就不可能有爱。或者，当有了欲望——性的欲望或其他欲望，它就会产生阻碍，因为欲望是思想的一部分，它阻止了爱。
53:03	And also we should consider in our examination together the nature of fear, because we are all caught in this terrible thing called fear. We don’t seem to be able to resolve it. We live with it, become accustomed to it, or escape from it, through amusement, through worship, through various forms of entertainment, religious and otherwise. So we must together examine again the nature and the structure of fear. Please, fear is common to all of us, whether you live in this tidy, clean country, or in India where it is untidy, dirty, over-populated, and so on. It is the same problem, fear. And man has lived with it for thousands and thousands of years, and we haven’t been able to resolve it. Is it possible – one is asking this question most seriously – is this at all possible to be totally completely free of fear, not only physical forms of fear but much more subtle forms of fear inwardly. Conscious fears and the deep undiscovered fears, fears that are deeply in our consciousness which we have never even examined that they are there.	同样的，我们也应该在一起检视的过程中去思考恐惧的本质，因为我们都困于这个叫做恐惧的可怕事物里。我们似乎无法解决它。我们与它共存，变得习以为常，或者会去逃避它；通过消遣、通过崇拜、通过各式各样的娱乐——宗教娱乐或其他娱乐——来逃避。所以我们必须一起再来检视恐惧的本质和结构。请注意，恐惧是我们的共同点，无论你是居住在这个整齐、干净的国家，还是居住在印度——杂乱、肮脏、人口过剩，等等—— 都有同样的问题，恐惧。而人类已经与它共存了千千万万年，而我们还是无法解决它。是否可能——我们在非常严肃地问这个问题—— 是否真的可能彻底摆脱恐惧，不只是身体上的恐惧，也包括形式更微妙的，内在的恐惧。意识上的恐惧以及内心深处未被发掘的恐惧，深藏在我们意识中的恐惧 ——我们甚至从未去审视过它们就在那儿。
55:34	Examination does not mean analysis. I know it is the fashion that if you have any problem turn to the analyst. I hope there aren’t any here! And the analyst is like you and me, only he has got a certain technique. But we must examine what is observation and analysis. Analysis implies there is an analyser. Is the analyser different from that which he analyses? Or the analyser is the analysed? You understand the question? The analyser is the analysed. That is an obvious fact. I am analysing myself but who is the analyser, in me, who says, ‘I must analyse’? It is still the analyser separating himself from the analysed, and then examining that which is going to be analysed - right? So, the analyser is that which he is examining, analysing. Both are the same, it is a trick played by thought. So, when we observe, there is no analysis, merely to observe things as they are. To observe actually what is, not to analyse what is, because in the process of analysis one can deceive oneself. And if you like to play that game you can go on endlessly until you die analysing, and never bringing about a radical transformation within oneself. Whereas observation, to look, to look at the present world as it is, not as a Dutchman, Englishman, or French or this or that, but to see actually what is happening. That is observation, pure observation of things as they are.	审视并不意味着分析。我知道现在流行的就是如果你有任何问题你就会去找精神分析师。我希望这里没有这样的人！那些分析师和你我并没什么不同，只是他懂得一些技巧而已。但我们必须检视什么是观察，什么是分析。分析暗示着有一个分析者。这个分析者和他所分析的对象是不同的吗？还是分析者本身就是被分析的事物？你们明白这个问题吗？分析者就是他所分析的事物。这是一个明显的事实。我在分析我自己，但那个在我里面，说“我必须分析”的分析者是谁？它仍旧是那个把自己从被分析事物中分离出来的分析者。然后这个分析者去检视那个将要被分析的事物——对吗？所以，分析者就是他所检视和分析的事物。两者是一样的。那只是思想的把戏。所以，当我们观察时，并不存在分析，只是去观察事物的真实模样。去观察事实，而不是去分析事实，因为在分析的过程中，我们会欺骗自己。而如果你喜欢去玩那个游戏，你可以永远分析下去，直到你死去那天，但你将永远无法带来一次内在彻底的转变。然而观察，去看，去看如今世界的真实模样，不是作为荷兰人、英国人、法国人，这个国家或那个国家的人去看，而是去观看实际上所发生的事情。这就是观察，纯粹地去观察事物的真实模样。
58:34	So we have to examine or observe what fear is, not what is the cause of fear – we will look at that presently – not what is the cause of fear which implies analysis, going further, further back, the origin of fear, – we’ll find that out in a minute – but to learn the art of observing, not translating what you observe, or interpreting what you observe but just to observe, as you would observe a lovely flower. The moment you tear it to pieces the flower is not. That is what analysis is. But to observe the beauty of a flower, the light in a cloud, the evening light, a tree by itself in a forest, just to observe it. So similarly if we can, to observe fear. What is the root of fear, not the various aspects of fear? Right? Can we go on with this? That is, suppose I am afraid. Suppose – I am not – suppose I am afraid, I must make this point very clear. What the speaker says, he lives, otherwise he wouldn’t get up on a platform and talk about it. He has done it for sixty years, he wouldn’t deceive himself, one can, but he has gone into it very deeply. So what he says is what to him is a fact, not just an illusion, an escape.	所以我们必须去检视或者观察什么是恐惧，不是恐惧的原因——这个我们过会儿再来看，不是恐惧的原因——恐惧的原因就意味着在分析了，深入一点，退回一点，去找到恐惧的源头 ——这个我们一会儿就来探讨；但是要学习观察的艺术，不是诠释你所观察到的事物，或解释你所看到的东西，而只是去观察，就像你观察一朵美丽的花。当你把它撕成碎片时，它就不再是花了。但分析就是这样做的。而是要去观察一朵花的美丽，一朵云的光彩，黄昏的霞光，森林中的一棵孤树，只是观察它。所以同样的，如果我们可以的话，也这样去观察恐惧。观察恐惧的根源是什么，而不是恐惧的各个面向。对吗？我们可以继续下去吗？也就是说，假如我感到害怕。只是假如，我并不害怕，但假如我害怕的话，我必须把这点说清楚。讲话者是言行一致的，否则他不会走上讲台谈论这些。他已经讲了六十年，他不会自我欺骗，你们会自我欺骗，但他已经非常深入地探究了它。所以他所说的，对他来说都是事实，不是一种错觉，也不是一种逃避。
1:00:47	So we are asking if it is at all possible to be free of fear, absolutely. Psychologically, inwardly, what is the root of fear? What does fear mean? Fear of something that has given you pain, fear of what might happen. That is the past, or what might happen in the future - right? Not what might happen now because now there is no fear. But you can see for yourself fear is a time process - right? Fear of something that has happened last week, an incident which has brought psychological pain, or physical pain, and the fear that it might happen again tomorrow: losing a job, not achieving something you want, not achieving illumination and all that stuff. So fear is a movement in time - right? A movement from the past through the present, modifying itself to the future. So the origin of fear is thought. And thought is time, because thought is the accumulation of knowledge through experience, memory, response of memory, thought, action. So thought-time are one, and thought-time is the root of fear. That is fairly obvious. It is so.	所以，我们问道，到底有没有可能完全摆脱恐惧？这是绝对可能的。从心理上和内在来看，恐惧的根源是什么？恐惧意味着什么？恐惧某种带给你痛苦的事物，恐惧也许会发生的事情。也就是，恐惧过去或者未来也许会发生的事，对吗？不是此刻将会发生的事，因为此刻并不存在恐惧。但你可以自己看到，恐惧是一个时间的过程——对吗？恐惧某件发生在上星期的事，一件给你带来了心理上痛苦或生理上痛苦的事，害怕它明天也许会再次发生；失去工作，没有完成你想要做的事情，没有获得开悟，等等这类东西。所以恐惧是一种时间里的运动，对吗？一种来自于过去，通过了现在，然后修改了自身而进入到未来的运动。所以恐惧的根源就是思想。而思想是时间，因为思想是通过经验而积累起来的知识，记忆，记忆的反应，思想，行动。所以思想和时间是一体的，思想和时间就是恐惧的根源。这是显而易见的。就是这样。
1:03:35	Now, it is not a question of stopping thought or time. Of course it would be impossible to stop it because who is the entity that says, ‘I must stop thought’? Which would be absurd because that entity is part of thought. Are you following all this? So this idea of stopping thought is impossible. That implies a controller who is trying to control thought. The controller is created by thought. So please just listen to this, just observe. The observation is an action in itself, not that one must do something about fear. I wonder if you understand this?	然而，这并不是一个停止思想或时间的问题。停止它当然是不可能的，因为那个说”我必须停止思想“的实体是谁？这是很可笑的，因为那个实体本身就是思想的一部分。你理解这一切吗？所以停止思想的想法是不可能实现的。那意味着一个控制者在努力控制思想。这个控制者是思想创造出来的。所以请只是聆听这些，只是去观察。这观察本身就是一种行动，而不是说我们必须要对恐惧做点什么。我不知道你是否理解了这点？
1:04:35	Look: suppose I am afraid about something or other, darkness, my wife running away, or I am lonely, or this or that. I am frightened, deeply. You come along and tell me, you explain to me the whole movement of fear, the origin of fear, which is time. I had pain, or I went through some accident, incident that has caused fear, recorded it in the brain, and that memory of that past incident might happen again, and therefore there is fear. So you have explained this to me. And I listen very carefully to your explanation, I see the logic of it, the sanity of it, I don’t reject it, I listen. And that means listening becomes an art. I don’t reject what you are saying, nor accept, but observe. So I observe that what you tell me about time, thought, is actual. I don’t say, ‘I must stop time and thought’, but you have explained to me, don’t do that, but just observe how fear arises, it is a movement of thought, time. Just observe this movement and don’t move away from it, don’t escape from it, live with it, look at it, put your energy in your looking. Then you will see that fear begins to dissolve because you have done nothing about it, you have just observed, you have given your attention to it. That very attention is like bringing light on fear. Attention means giving all your energy in that observation. Is this clear somewhat? Sir, unfortunately we have only two talks, I wish there were more talks. If you begin to ask questions we will become something different. But I hope you don’t mind if I go on. May I?	你看，假设我害怕这个或者那个东西，害怕黑暗、害怕妻子离开，或者我感到孤独，这个或那个。内心深处，我感到害怕。而你过来告诉我，你对我讲解恐惧的整个运作，恐惧的根源——也就是时间。我有过痛苦，或者我经历过一次事故，那个引起恐惧的事件，被记录在我脑中，害怕那个过去事件的记忆会再次发生，所以就产生了恐惧。所以你已经为我解释了这一切。而我也非常仔细地聆听了你的解释，我看到它的逻辑，它的合理性，我不排斥它，我聆听。而那意味着聆听变成了一种艺术。我并不排斥你所说的，也不接受，只是观察。所以我观察到你所告诉我的关于时间和思想的事，是真实的。我没有说，“我必须停止时间与思想”，但你已经解释给我听了，不要这样做，而只是去观察恐惧如何出现，它是一种思想和时间的运动。只是去观察这个运动，而不要离开它，不要逃避它，而是与它共存，观察它，把你的能量用在你的观察中。然后你就会看到恐惧开始消融，因为你没有对它做任何事，你只是去观察，你注意它。这种注意本身就像是照亮了恐惧。注意意味着在观察中付出你所有的能量。你是否多多少少清楚了一点？先生，很不幸我们只有两次讲话，我希望能有更多的讲话。如果你们开始发问，我们的关系就会变得不同了。但我希望你们不介意我继续讲下去。我可以吗？
1:07:50	So, observation without analysis implies giving your total attention to a problem. The problem which is relationship, the problem which is fear, and also we have to go into the problem of pleasure. May I ask what time it is? Beg your pardon? Quarter past twelve. We have talked for an hour. Do you want to continue another half an hour? Can you bear it? It’s up to you, not to me, sirs.	所以，没有分析的观察意味着把你全部的注意力放在一个问题上。关系的问题，恐惧的问题，而我们也必须去探讨欢愉的问题。我可以问一下现在几点了吗？请再说一次？十二点十五分。我们已经讲了一个小时。你们想要继续再听半个小时吗？你们能忍耐吗？这取决于你们，而不是我，先生们。
1:08:57	Also – sir, would you mind not taking photographs. Please, this is very serious all this. This is not something you play with for a day and drop it. It concerns our lives, our whole existence. And if you are at all serious we must give our attention to all this.	同样的，先生，你是否可以不要拍照。拜托，这一切都是非常严肃的。它并不是某种你们玩个一天就抛弃的东西。它关系到我们的生活，我们的整个存在。如果你们真的很认真，那就必须把注意力都放在它上面。
1:09:42	Why is it that man has pursued pleasure? Please ask yourself why. Is pleasure opposite to pain? Please go into it a little bit. We have all had pain of different kinds, both physical and psychological. Psychologically most of us from childhood have been wounded, hurt, that is pain. And the consequence of that pain has been to withdraw, isolate oneself, not to be further hurt. We are hurt from childhood, through school, by comparing ourselves with somebody else who is more clever. We have hurt ourselves and others have hurt us through various forms of scoldings, hurting, saying something brutal, terrorising us. And there is this deep hurt with all its consequences, which is isolation, resistance, more and more withdrawing. And the opposite of that we think is pleasure. Pain and the opposite of it is pleasure. Is that so?	为什么人类要追求欢愉？请问问自己为什么。欢愉是痛苦的反面吗？请稍微深入一点。我们都曾经历过各种痛苦，既包括生理上的也包括心理上的。心理上，我们大多数人从幼年就受到了伤害，打击，这就是痛苦。而这痛苦的后果就是退缩，隔离自己，避免受到进一步的伤害。我们从小就受到伤害，在学校里，我们把自己与那些更聪明的人比较。我们就这样伤害了自己，也受到别人的伤害，通过各种形式的斥责、伤害，对我们说些粗暴的话语，恐吓我们。有着这种深深的伤害以及它所产生的后果，包括孤立、抗拒，越来越退缩自闭。而与之相反的，我们认为是欢愉。痛苦，它的反面便是欢愉。是这样吗？
1:11:37	So we have to examine closely if you have the energy, if you have the time, if you want to, is goodness opposite of that which is not good? If goodness is the opposite, then that goodness contains its own opposite - right? Therefore it is not good. Goodness is something totally separate from that which it is not. So, is pleasure – please just listen to this if you don’t mind, one is asking this most respectfully – is pleasure something opposite of pain? Or it is a contrast and we are always pursuing the contrast, the opposite. So one is asking, is pleasure separate entirely, like goodness – which is not pleasurable? You understand? Or is pleasure tainted by pain? So when you look closely at pleasure it is always remembrance, isn’t it? One never says when one is happy, ‘How happy I am’, it is always after, the remembrance of that thing which gave you pleasure, and the remembrance of that pleasure. Like a sunset, when you look at the glory of the evening, full of that extraordinary light, there is great pleasure, great delight. Then that is remembered, then pleasure is born. So, pleasure is part of thought too. It is so obvious.	所以我们必须去密切地检视——如果你有能量，如果你有时间，如果你想要去检视的话。良善是不是不善的反面？如果良善是反面的话，那么那种良善就包含了其自身的对立面——对吗？因此它就不是良善了。良善是某种完全和不善的事物所分离的东西。所以，欢愉是不是——如果你不介意的话，请聆听这些，我是非常礼貌地在问这个问题 ——欢愉是不是痛苦的反面？或者它是一个对比物，而我们总是在追求着那个对比物，那个对立面。所以我在问，欢愉是不是完全独立的， ——就像良善，它并不带来欢愉？你明白吗？还是说欢愉被痛苦玷污了？所以当你密切地观察欢愉时，会发现它常常是一种回忆，不是吗？当一个人感到快乐时，他永远不会说 “我多么快乐”，他总是事后才说的，对某事物的记忆带给你欢愉，以及对那个欢愉的回忆。就像一次日落，当你欣赏黄昏的壮丽 ——它充满了奇异的光彩，这带来了巨大的欢愉和喜悦。然后它就被记住了，于是欢愉便产生了。所以，欢愉也是思想的一部分。这非常明显。
1:14:24	So the next problem is – it is very complex, like all human problems – is it possible to end all sorrow? Because where there is sorrow there is no love. Where there is sorrow obviously there cannot be intelligence. We will go into that word, which is a very complex word, intelligence.	所以下一个问题是 ——就像所有人类问题一样，这个问题也是非常复杂的—— 是否可能结束所有的悲伤？因为有了悲伤就不会有爱。如果有了悲伤，很显然就不可能会有智慧。我们来探讨这个词——它是一个非常复杂的词：智慧。
1:15:10	You know, the understanding of relationship, fear, pleasure and sorrow, is to bring order in our house. Without order you cannot possibly meditate. You understand that word? Unfortunately that word has been brought to the West by the Eastern people. Now, the speaker puts meditation at the end of the talks because there is no possibility of right meditation if you have not put your house, psychological house, in order. If the house is in disorder, psychological house, what you are, if that house is not in order what is the point of meditating? It is just an escape. It leads to all kinds of illusions. And you may sit cross legged or stand on your head for the rest of your life but that is not meditation. Meditation must begin with bringing about complete order in your house: that is, order in your relationship, order in one’s desires, pleasure and so on.	你知道，了解关系、恐惧、欢愉和悲伤，就是给我们的房子带来秩序。没有秩序，你是不可能冥想的。你明白这个词吗？很不幸，这个词已经被带到了西方 ——是东方人带过来的。现在，讲话者把冥想放在讲话的最后，因为你不可能会有正确的冥想 ——如果你没有让你的房子，心理上的房子变得井然有序的话。如果房子处于混乱之中——心理上的房子，也就是你的真实模样—— 如果那个房子没有秩序，冥想又有什么意义呢？它只是一种逃避，将会导致各种幻觉。你也许可以在你余下的生命里盘腿而坐，或者倒立，但那并不是冥想。冥想必须从让你的房子井然有序开始，也就是，关系中的秩序、欲望中的秩序、欢愉中的秩序，等等。
1:17:11	And also, one of our causes of disorder in our life is sorrow. This is a common factor, common reality in all human beings. Everyone goes through this tragedy of sorrow, here or in the Asiatic world or in the Western world. Again this is a common thing we all share. There is not only so-called personal sorrow but there is the sorrow of mankind, sorrow which wars have brought about, five thousand years of historical record, every year there has been a war, killing each other, violence, terror, brutality, maiming people, people have no hands, eyes, all the horrors and the brutality of war, which has brought incalculable misery to mankind. It is not only one’s own sorrow but the sorrow of mankind, the sorrow when you see a man who has nothing whatsoever, just a piece of cloth and for the rest of one’s life he is going to be that way. Not in these Western countries but in the Asiatic world it is like that. And when you see that person there is sorrow. There is also sorrow when people are caught in illusion; like going from one guru to another, which is escaping from yourself. That is a sorrow, to observe this. The clever people going off to the East. Writing books about it, praising some guru, and we all fall for that nonsense. That is also sorrow. Sorrow that comes when you see what the politicians are doing in the world. Thinking in terms of tribalism, that is also sorrow.	另外，我们生活中混乱的另一个原因就是悲伤。这是我们的共同之处，所有人类共同的事实。每一个人都会经历这种痛苦的悲剧，不管是在这里，还是在亚洲，或者在西方世界。同样的，这也是我们所有人共有的事物。不仅有着所谓的个人悲伤，也存在着人类的悲伤，战争带来的悲伤，五千年的历史记载中，每一年都有战争，人类互相残杀，暴力、恐怖活动、残暴行为、致残人类，那些失去了双手双眼的人，所有战争的恐怖和暴行，它给人类带来了难以计数的痛苦。这并不是某个人自己的悲伤，而是全人类的悲伤，那种当你看到一个人一无所有，只穿着一块破布，并且在余生中也将一直如此，这时感到的悲伤。在那些西方国家里没有这样的人，但在亚洲却有这样的人。当你看到那个人时，就会感到悲伤。当你看见人们陷入于幻觉中时同样也会感到悲伤，人们从一个古鲁换到另一个古鲁——那只是在逃避你自己。观察到这些，它就是一种悲伤。聪明的人们去到东方，写了很多关于东方的书，赞美某个古鲁，而我们全都迷信这些胡言乱语。这也是一种悲伤。悲伤也来自于当你看到那些政客在世界上的所作所为。依照部落主义的方式思考，这也是一种悲伤。
1:20:23	So there is personal sorrow and the vast cloud of sorrow of mankind. Sorrow is not something romantic, sentimental, illogical, it is there. My son dies and it has shattered one’s life. And we have lived with this sorrow from time measureless. And apparently one has not resolved this problem. When one suffers one seeks consolation, which is an escape from the fact of sorrow. When there is that grief, you try every form of amusement, escape, but it is always there. And apparently humanity has not resolved it. And we are asking the question whether it is possible to be free of it completely? Not avoiding it, not seeking consolation, not escaping into some fanciful theory, but to live with it. Just let’s understand what we mean by that word to ‘live with it’: not to let it become a habit like most people do; they live with nationalities, which is most destructive, they live with their own separate religious conclusions, they live with their own fanciful ideas and ideals, and that again brings their own conflict. So to live with something, to live with sorrow, not accept it, not become habituated to it, that is, to look at it, to observe it without any escape, without any question of trying to go beyond it, just to hold it in your hand and look. Which is, sorrow is also part of this tremendous sense of loneliness, you may have many friends, you may be married, you may have all kinds of things, but inwardly there is this feeling of complete loneliness. And that is part of sorrow. To observe that loneliness without any direction, without trying to go beyond it, without trying to find a substitute for it, to live with it, not worship it, not become psychotic about it. Which means to give all your attention to that pain, to that grief, to that sorrow. So when my son dies, or somebody whom I think I love, dies, there is great grief, and without running away from it, just to... It is a great thing to understand suffering because then where there is freedom from sorrow, there is compassion. And one is not compassionate as long as you are anchored to any belief, to your particular form of religious symbol. Compassion is freedom from sorrow. And where there is compassion there is love, and with that compassion goes intelligence – not the intelligence of thought with its cunning, with its adjustments, with its capacity to put up with anything. Compassion means the ending of sorrow and only then is there intelligence.	所以存在着个人的悲伤和笼罩着人类的悲伤的巨大阴云。悲伤并非某种浪漫、感性、不合逻辑的东西，它就在那里。我的儿子死去了，这让我的生活变得支离破碎。从无限久远的时候开始，我们就伴随着这种悲伤而生活了。而很显然，我们还未能解决这个问题。当我们受苦时，我们会寻求慰籍 ——这只是一种对悲伤事实的逃避。当有了那种悲痛时，你尝试各种娱乐、各种逃避，但悲伤却总是在那里。而很显然人类还未能解决它。而我们在问这个问题：是否有可能完全地摆脱它？不是回避它，不是寻求慰籍，不是逃避到某些异想天开的理论里，而是与它共存。让我们来了解我们所说的“与它共存”的意思：不是让它成为一种习惯——就像大多数人所做的那样；他们与国家主义共存——那是最具破坏性的，他们与各自的宗教结论共存，他们与各自空想的理念和理想共存， ——而这同样也会带来他们自身的冲突。所以与某个事物共存，与悲伤共存，不接受它，也不对它上瘾，也就是，去看它，去观察它而没有任何逃避，也不存在任何试图去超越它的问题，只是把它握在你的手里然后去看。那就是，悲伤同样也是这种巨大孤独感中的一部分，你可能有很多朋友，你可能结婚了，你可能应有尽有，但在你内心里却有着一种彻底的孤独感。而那就是悲伤的一部分。去观察那种孤独——没有方向地观察，不试图去超越它，不试图去寻找它的替代品；与它共存，不膜拜它，不因它而神经过敏。那意味着全神贯注于那种痛苦、那种悲痛、那种悲伤。所以当我的儿子死去，或者某个我认为我爱的人死去时，我感到强烈的悲痛，却不逃离它，而只是... 这是一件伟大的事，那就是去了解苦难，因为当你摆脱了悲伤，就会有慈悲。因为你并不是慈悲的——只要你还是紧抓着任何信仰，紧抓着你特定形式的宗教符号。慈悲就是脱离悲伤。当有了慈悲，就会有爱，而伴随着那种慈悲，就会有智慧。不是思想的智慧及其精明狡猾、见风使舵和它容忍事物的能力。慈悲意味着悲伤的结束，只有那时才会有智慧。
1:26:51	We will continue tomorrow if you don’t mind, talking about death, what happens, if anything happens after death, and what is the significance of death, and what is meditation. That is if you can bear it until tomorrow.	如果你不介意的话，明天我们将会继续探讨死亡的问题，死后会发生什么——如果有任何事发生的话，死亡的意义又是什么，以及什么是冥想。如果你能忍受明天还谈论这些的话。
1:27:27	May I most respectfully request that you don’t clap. By clapping you are not encouraging me. You are clapping because you understand it for yourself.	我能否以非常尊敬的态度请求你们不要鼓掌。你的掌声并不是在为我鼓劲。你鼓掌是因为你自己明白了这一切。
1:27:52	SUBTITLE TEXT COPYRIGHT 1981 KRISHNAMURTI FOUNDATION TRUST LTD	字幕文本版权所有，1981年克里希那穆提信托基金会