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BR77T4 - 良善的绽放是一个时间的问题吗？
1977年9月4日
英国布洛克伍德公园第四次公开对话



0:19 This is the last talk. I’m sure most of you will be glad. So am I. 这是最后一次讲话。 我确信你们绝大部分人都很高兴，我也是。
0:38 We have been talking over, together, last Saturday and Sunday and yesterday, and during the discussions, question and answer and so on, many of our human problems. Our consciousness, which is ourselves, is so filled with other people’s ideas, with our own concepts and conclusions, with our fears, anxieties, pleasure, occasional flash of joy and sorrow and a great many ideas. That’s our consciousness. That is what we are. And, if one may point out, as we have been doing during the last fifty years and more, that ideas do not bring about a radical change in human consciousness. Idea comes – the root meaning of that word is to observe. What we do is to observe and make an abstraction of what we have seen into an idea, and live according to that idea. That has been the pattern of our existence. 上周六周天， 还有昨天，我们共同讨论过， 问答过 许多人类的问题。 我们的意识，也就是我们本身， 充满了其他人的观点， 还有我们自己的概念，结论， 我们的恐惧，焦虑， 快感，偶尔也有闪现的喜悦， 还有悲伤，大量的观点。 这就是我们的意识，就是我们本身。 另外，如果我能指出的话，就像我们 过去五十年，乃至更久说所的， 观念不会带来， 人类意识的根本性转变。 观念——这个词根本的意识是去观察。 我们（实际）做的是观察， 然后基于我们看到的，抽象出一些观念， 然后基于那些观念生活。 这就是我们存在的模式。
2:37 We have been talking about the radical change in human consciousness, whether it is at all possible, and if it is not possible we are, everlastingly, living in a prison of our own ideas, our own concepts within a field where there is every kind of confusion, uncertainty, instability. And we seem to think if we move from one corner of that field to another, we think that we have greatly changed, but it is still in the same field. I think very few of us realise that fact: that as long as we live within that area of what we call our consciousness, however little change, or however great change within that field, there is no fundamental human transformation. 我们讨论过人类意识的 彻底转变， 这一切是否有可能，如果这不可能， 那我们就永远生活在一个监狱中， 我们自身观点，概念的监狱， 充满了各种各样的困惑， 不确定，不稳定。 我们似乎认为如果我们从这个监狱的一个角落去到另一个， 我们就彻底的改变了， 然而这仍然是在同一个监狱中。 我认为我们中只有非常少的人认识到这个事实： 只要我们生活在我们 所谓的我们意识的领域， 这个领域不管多大或者多小的变化， 都不是人类的彻底的转变。
4:01 And meditation – that’s what we’re going to discuss, this morning. When we are going to talk over together this question of meditation, I think one should be very clear about certain things: ideations, or ideologies however clever, however thought-out, ultimately, bring about dangerous illusions, whether they are the ideologies of the right or the centre or the extreme left, they all either end up in great bureaucracies controlling man, or concentration camps, or the destruction – moulding man, according to a particular concept. This is what is happening throughout the world. And the intellectuals have led us up to this point, right throughout the world. They have accepted with a great delight and a great energy the whole ideological concept of Marxism, Maoism, and so on. And they have all led to a great deal of confusion, misery, concentration camps and all the rest of it – whether the right or the left, or the centre. 冥想——我们今早就要讨论它。 当我们一同探讨 冥想的问题时， 我认为一个人必须非常清楚这一点： 观念，或者意识形态， 不管多么聪明，多么深思熟虑， 最终，只会带来危险的幻觉， 不管是右派， 中间派，或者极端左派的意识形态， 他们都要么以控制人的官僚机构结束， 要么以集中营，或破坏结束 ——根据某种概念去塑造人。 这就是全世界正在发生的事。 知识分子就在带我们走向这一步， 全世界都是如此。 他们满怀喜悦和能量的接受了 马克思主义，或者毛主义等等的，全部意识形态的概念。 他们都导向了大量的困惑， 苦难，集中营，及其他种种 ——不管是右派，左派，或者中间派。
5:53 And we have also been prisoners of religious ideas, ideologies – the Catholic, the Hindu, the Buddhists and so on. Or the traditional acceptance of the gurus with their modern modifications of the ancient traditions, with their ideologies. And they’re also becoming prisoners of those ideologies. 此外我们还都是宗教概念，意识形态的囚徒 —— 天主教徒、印度教徒、佛教徒等等。 或者传统上对大师的接受， 带着他们对古老传统的现代化改良， 带着他们的意识形态。 他们都变成了意识形态的囚徒。
6:27 So, if one observes all this carefully, impersonally, objectively, one must put away all ideologies. And then, if you have no ideology, then how do we act? That is one of the problems which we more or less talked about, some time ago. Actions based on ideologies are immoral because you are then conforming to a particular pattern. Is morality, ethics, the acceptance of authority and following certain laid-down policy of ideologies and so on? Or is morality something totally free from all ideologies? And we’re going to talk over, together, this morning, this question which, unfortunately, has been brought to this country and to the various Western countries, by so-called gurus, with their ideas of meditation. 所以，如果一个人看到这一切， 仔细地，非个人地，客观地看到， 一个人必须摆脱所有的意识形态。 然后，如果没有意识形态，我们该如何行动？ 这是我们之前 或多或少讨论过的一个问题。 基于意识形态的行动是不成熟的， 因为这样你只是在遵从某个特定的模式。 道德，伦理是对权威的接受， 追随某些规定或者意识形态等等吗？ 或者道德是某种和任何意识形态都完全不相关的事？ 今早，我们就要共同讨论 这个非常不幸地， 已经被所谓的大师带来带到这个国家及 其他许多西方国家的，冥想的概念。
8:05 So, can we talk over, together, this morning, this question? That is, we are both of us thinking together, investigating together. There is no authority here, though the speaker sits on a platform, it doesn’t give him any authority. Please, let’s be quite sure of that. Because if there is authority, there’s no freedom. And without freedom, there is no compassion, there is no clarity, there is no skill in action which we have talked about a great deal. So, we are on the same level, at the same time, with the same intensity, investigating this. When we are at the same level, at the same time, with the same intensity, that’s love. And without love, we cannot possibly understand this very complex problem of what is meditation – not how to meditate, that’s too absurd, but what is the meaning and the significance of meditation? So, we are both of us freely enquiring into this – not that you have learnt something from somebody, how to meditate, which may be like practising on a piano, the wrong note all the time. 所以，今天早晨我们能一起探讨这一切吗？ 也就是我们一起思考，一起探索。 这里没有权威，虽然演讲者坐在讲台上， 但这不会给他带来任何权威感。 请务必确认这一点。 因为如果有权威，就没有自由。 没有自由，就没有慈悲， 没有清晰，也没有行动中的技巧， 这些我们都讨论了很多了。 所以，我们在同一时刻，处于同样的层级， 带着同样的强度，来探索。 当我们在同一层级，同一时间，有同样的强度， 这就会有爱。 而没有爱，我们不可能理解， 什么是冥想，这一个非常复杂的问题 ——不是如何冥想，这太荒唐了， 而是冥想的意义和重要性是什么？ 所以，我们都在自由的探索 ——不是你从某人那里学习如何冥想， 这就像一直在一架钢琴上练错误的音。
10:12 So, in enquiring into this very complex problem, one must ask, for oneself, whether this content of consciousness, which is what we are, with all our conflicts, struggles, confusion, misery and occasional happiness, whether that consciousness can become aware of itself and empty itself? That’s one problem in meditation. 所以，在探究这个非常复杂的问题时， 一个人必须问自己，是否意识的内容， 也就是我们的本质，带着我们的冲突，挣扎， 困惑，痛苦，以及偶尔的欢愉， 这个意识能否意识到它自身，并且清空它？ 这是冥想中的一个问题。
10:54 The other is the question of time, which is, is there psychological progress? That is, is there psychological evolution? That’s the second point. And the other is space, whether there is space in which there is no direction, in which there is no centre. We are going to enquire into all this. And we’re also going to enquire what is beauty. Because, otherwise, without beauty, there is no love. And also we’re going to enquire if there is anything sacred, holy. This is the whole movement of our investigation, which is, whether consciousness, with all its content, which makes up our consciousness, whether it can be totally, completely emptied? And the question of time, which is the psychological time, which gives us the idea that we shall gradually progress, evolve, become better. The whole concept of that. 另一个问题是关于时间， 也就是，存在心理的过程吗？ 也就是存在心理的进化吗？ 这是第二点。 还有一点是空间， 是否存在没有方向， 也就没有中心的空间。 我们要探究这一切。 我们也要探究什么是美。 因为，否则，没有美就没有爱。 我们还要探究是否存在神圣的事物。 这就是我们探索的全部活动， 也就是，是否意识以及它全部的内容， 内容就组成了意识， 能被彻底，完全的，清空？ 还有，心理时间的问题， 它让我们觉得会逐渐进步， 进化，变得更好。 这一切的整个概念。
13:02 And is good, the flowering of goodness, is it a matter of time? And is goodness the opposite of that which is not good? And we also have to enquire into the question of space. I’m repeating this, so that we know the whole thing that we’re talking about. And whether there is beauty – beauty not of things, of ideas, of structure, but beauty in itself, fundamentally, is there anything that is essentially beautiful and, therefore, good? And our enquiry also must come into, is there, ultimately, in our life, daily life, anything that is holy, sacred? This is the meaning of meditation. And any system, any method, which promises a reward is not meditation, obviously. If you do this, you will get that. That is our centuries of conditioning: reward and punishment, hell and heaven. If you do the right thing, if you believe in what the church says, you will reach heaven. If you don’t, down you go! And all the rest of that business, right throughout the world. Our conditioning is based on this reward and punishment. And meditation is not seeking an end. It is not trying to grope after a purpose, a goal, an end. Because if you have a motive, then the motive dictates what the end is. And enquiry, like all good scientists, first-class, top scientists, they have no motive, they enquire. In the enquiry, they find out. So, one must understand this desire to reach a goal, a purpose, an end. And where there is desire, which we’ve gone into, very carefully, the nature of desire which is perception, contact, sensation, then desire, with all its images – then desire, in meditation, brings about illusion. Obviously. 良善，良善的绽放，是时间的问题吗？ 良善是那些不是良善的事物的对立面吗？ 我们也要探究空间的问题。 我在重复这一切，所以我们能知道 我们要讨论的全部内容。 以及是否存在美 ——不是事物，观念，结构的美， 而是美本身， 根本的美，是否存在本质上就美的事物， 因此，就是良善的？ 我们的探究， 最终也必须涉及我们的生活，日常生活， 有任何神圣的事物吗？ 这就是冥想的意义。 任何系统，任何方法，只要许诺了一个奖励， 显然就不是冥想。 如果你做这个，你就会得到那个。 这就是我们数个世纪以来的制约： 奖励和惩罚，天堂和地狱。 如果你做正确的事，同时你相信教堂里人说的， 你就会上天堂。 如果你不做，下地狱吧！ 以及这个世界上发生的，其他种种一切。 我们的制约就是基于奖励和惩罚。 而冥想不是在追求一个结果。 不是追求某个目的，目标，解决。 因为，如果你有一个动机， 那这个动机就暗示了结果是什么。 就像所有好的科学家， 第一等的，最好的科学家，他们没有动机，只是探索。 在这种探索中，他们就能发现。 所以，一个人必须理解这种想要达成某个目标， 某个意图，某种结果的欲望。 哪里有这种欲望， 我们会仔细的探究它， 欲望的本质就是，观察，接触，感知， 然后产生欲望和它所有的意象 ——然后欲望，就在冥想之中制造各种幻觉。 很显然。
17:02 Now, can we proceed really, together? I mean together – not I talk and you listen but together, freely, without any distortion, without any conclusion, begin not knowing what meditation is. And in the process of this enquiry, into the things that we are going to talk about, consciousness and so on, that very enquiry becomes meditation. You understand? Not that you must meditate, nor how to meditate and the problem of meditation, but in the process of enquiry, that very movement is meditation. Is this clear? Can we proceed from there? I don’t know if you’re interested, or if you are at all serious about this question of meditation, because it’s very important to find out, because out of this comes immense silence. Not cultivated silence, not the silence between two thoughts, between two noises but a silence that is unimaginable. So, the brain becomes extraordinarily quiet when in the process of enquiry. And that’s why, when there is silence, there’s great perception. And in this silence, there is emptiness, that emptiness is the summation of all energy. This is the problem of meditation. And if you’re not interested in it, I can’t help it. If you are not interested in it, then you will carry on your daily monotonous, bourgeois, or intellectual, or amusing life. 现在，我们真的在一同前进吗？ 我说的一同——不是我说你听， 而是一起，自由的， 没有任何扭曲，结论， 不知道冥想是什么。 然后在探究的过程中， 探究我们将要讨论的事， 意识，等等， 这种探究就是冥想。 你明白吗？ 不是你必须冥想， 不是如何去冥想，以及冥想的问题， 而是在这种探究的过程中， 这种活动就是冥想。 这一点清楚了吗？我们可以继续吗？ 我不知道你是否感兴趣， 或者你是否严肃的看待冥想这个问题， 因为发现它很重要， 因为其中就会带来巨大的安静。 不是人为培养的安静， 不是两个思想，两个声音之间的安静， 而是无法想象的安静。 所以，在这个探究的过程中， 头脑变得极度安静。 这就是为什么，当有安静时，就会有深刻的洞察。 在这种安静中，就有空， 这种空就是所有能量的总和。 这就是冥想的问题。 如果你对这一切不感兴趣，那我也帮不了你。 如果你对它不感兴趣，那你就会继续 你的日常的，单调的，资产阶级的，或者知识分子的，或者有趣的生活。
19:42 So, let’s begin by enquiring, together. I’m insisting on – we are insisting on that word, together, because we have made this monstrous, brutal world, together, this immoral world, together. And so, in the enquiry of all this, there may be, and there will be, total transformation of ourselves and therefore a different society, a different social order and so on, differing governments, everything will come out of this – if you know what it is to meditate. 所以，让我们开始共同探究吧。 我坚持这一点——坚持“一起”这个词， 因为我们一起构建了这个可怕而残忍的世界， 这个不道德的世界。 所以，在探究这一切的过程中，也许会有 我们自身的彻底转变，因而就会有不同的社会， 不同的社会秩序，不同的政府，等等， 一切事物都会随之而来—— 如果你知道冥想是什么。
20:33 You can please ask questions afterwards, if you don’t mind. 如果你不介意，请稍后再问问题。
20:43 So, we are going to examine, together, this question of consciousness and its content. In examination of this, it is very important to find out whether you are examining it, or in observing, consciousness becomes aware of itself. You see the difference? I hope this is clear. That is, you can observe the movement of your consciousness, which is your desires, your hurts, your ambitions, your greeds, all the rest of it, which is the content of our consciousness, you can observe it from the outside, as it were, or whether consciousness becomes aware of itself. This is the problem. Whether you become aware of your consciousness, or – please, go into this with me, a little bit – or consciousness is lighted up and you observe? You understand? This is only possible when thought realises that what it has created, which is its consciousness, when thought realises it is only observing itself, not you, which thought has put together, observing consciousness. I don’t know how to put it. You understand this, a little bit? 所以，我们要一同探索， 意识的问题，以及它的内容。 在探究的过程中，发现你 是否在探究是很重要的， 或者是在观察，意识否能意识到它本身。 你看到不同了吗？我希望这一点很清楚了。 也就是，你能观察你意识的活动， 也就是你的欲望，你受到的伤害，你的野心，你的贪婪， 以及其他等等，这都是意识的内容， 你能从外在观察它，就像它本身的样子， 或者意识能否意识到它本身？ 这是一个问题。 你能否意识到自己的意识， 或者——请和我一起探究这一点—— 或者意识被照亮， 然后你观察？ 你明白吗？ 这只有在思想意识 到它创造的东西，也就是 意识本身， 当思想认识到 它只是在观察它自身时，才有可能， 不是你——你就是思想创造的——在观察意识。 我不知道如何去表达。你明白一点了吗？
23:07 Look, sir, nobody has to tell you that you’re hungry. There is hunger. In the same way, is it possible for thought to become aware of itself, for consciousness to be aware, itself, not that you are examining consciousness? Is this somewhat clear, or not? Because this is very important at the beginning of our examination. I want to examine consciousness. So, I begin to analyse the various aspects, the various contents of my consciousness. I’m greedy, I am angry, there is hatred, there is jealousy, there is happiness, there’s pleasure, there’re a great many hurts from childhood, flowering or controlled. I can examine them or there is observation and, therefore, consciousness begins to reveal itself. Do you see the difference? I observe the tree, the tree tells me all its story if I know how to observe. So, in the same way, I must learn how to observe – observe only, not tell consciousness what it should do. Right? Am I making it, somewhat, clear? 看，先生，没有人必须告诉你，你饿了。 只有饥饿。 同样的，思想能否意识到它本身， 也就是意识，意识到它自己， 不是你在检查，探究意识？ 这一点清楚了吗？ 因为，这很重要，要在探究之初弄清。 我想探究意识。 所以，我开始分析各种各样的概念， 我意识的各种内容。 我很贪婪，我很生气，这是仇恨，那是嫉妒， 这是快乐，那个是快感， 还有我童年受到的许多伤害， 正在绽放或者被控制住了。 我能探究、检查这一切， 或者是否有一种观察， 因此意识开始去揭示它本身。 你看到不同了吗？ 我观察一棵树，这棵树会告诉我它所有的故事， 如果我知道如何去观察。 所以，同样的，我必须学会如何观察 ——只是观察，不是告诉意识它应该做什么。 对吗？我说清楚了吗？
25:12 That is, if I want to examine consciousness, I separate myself from consciousness and then examine it, as an analyst. Whereas, if there is only observation – only observation – then consciousness begins to reveal its content, its story. I don’t have to tell the story about consciousness, consciousness tells its story. This is simple. I won’t elaborate that. So, that’s what we are doing, we are observing only, and so consciousness begins to show itself, not only the superficial consciousness but the deeper layers of consciousness, the whole content of consciousness. This is an art to be learnt, not memorised, not to say, ‘Well, I’ve heard this, I’m going to store it up in my brain and I’m going to learn about it.’ Then that is merely a mechanical process, which has no meaning, whatsoever. Whereas, if you see the importance of sheer, absolute, motionless observation, then the thing flowers, – consciousness opens up its doors, as it were. So, observation implies seeing the totality of consciousness. I wonder if… 也就是，如果我想探究意识， 我会把我本身和意识分开，然后作为一个分析者来探索。 然而，如果只有观察——只是观察—— 然后意识就能揭示它的内容，它的故事。 我不必讲述意识的故事， 意识会自己讲述它的故事。就这么简单。 我不会把它弄复杂。 所以，这就是我们要做的，我们只是观察， 所以，意识开始展示它自身， 不只是浅层的意识， 还有意识更深的层面， 意识的整个内容。 这就是要学习的艺术，不是去记忆，不是说， “好了，我已经听过这些了。我会把他们都放在脑子里， 我会学会的。” 这样只是机械的过程， 无论如何，没有什么意义。 然而，如果你看到 纯粹的，绝对的，不动的观察的重要性， 然后它就会绽放， ——意识打开了它的大门，展示它本来的样子。 所以，观察意味着看到意识的整体。 不知道我是否
27:16 Am I talking to myself? I hope not! One can have a dialogue with oneself. We did that the other day. I can have a dialogue about the whole question of meditation, with myself. But that’s entirely different – having a dialogue with each other. That’s what we are doing – although there are so many people here, we’re actually having a dialogue. There is only one person here and he or she and I, are talking about this. I’m telling him or her, to observe is the most important thing in life – not tell the observation how to observe, but to learn the art of observing without any distortion, without any motive, without any purpose, just to observe. In that there is tremendous beauty because then there is no distortion. You see things, clearly, as they are. But if you make an abstraction of it into an idea, and then through that idea observe, then it is a distortion. 我在和自己说话吗？我希望我没有！ 一个人可以和自己对话。 我们那几天做过这个。 我可以和自己对话，谈论 冥想的整个问题。 但是这和与他人对话完全不同。 这才是我们在做的，（与他人对话） ——虽然这里有很多人， 我们实际上是在进行对话。 只有一个人在这， 他或者她在和我对话。 我在告诉他或者她，观察是生命中最重要的事 ——不是在说如何去观察， 而是学习没有任何扭曲的观察的艺术， 没有任何动机，没有任何意图，只是去观察。 这其中就有巨大的美， 因为没有扭曲。 你清楚地看到了事实之是。 但是如果你把它抽象成一个概念， 然后通过那个概念观察，就会有扭曲。
29:12 Right? So, we are merely, freely, without any distorting factor entering into our observation, observing consciousness. So, consciousness begins to reveal its own totality. There is nothing hidden. Which is, the content, which is our hurt, our greed, our envy, our happiness, our beliefs, our ideologies, all that makes up consciousness, the past traditions, the present, scientific or factual traditions and so on, so on – all that is our consciousness. To observe it without any movement of thought, because thought has put all the content of our consciousness – thought has built it. When thought comes and says, ‘This is right, this is wrong, this should be, that…’, you’re still within the field of consciousness, you’re not going beyond it. So, one has to understand, very clearly, the place of thought. Thought has its own place in the field of knowledge, technology and all the rest of it. But thought has no place, whatsoever, in the psychological structure of man. When it does, then confusion begins, then contradiction and all the struggles, the images about you and another – all the rest of it, follows. So, the art, as we said, the meaning of ‘art’ means to put everything in its right place, not the painter, not the sculptor or the poet, but in our daily life, to put everything in its right place, that’s art. So, can you observe your consciousness and does it reveal its content – not bit by bit, but the totality of its movement? Then, only, is it possible to go beyond it. Not through analysis, which we talked about, because analysis implies the analyser and the analysed, the division, the problem of time in division, and when you analyse, each analysis must be totally complete. If there is not complete analysis, then the imperfection of that analysis is carried over to the next analysis, so imperfection grows more and more and more. You understand? Like practising on the piano and practising the wrong note, all the time. Right? So, that is our enquiry. 对吗？所以，我们只是在自由地， 没有任何扭曲因素地观察， 观察意识。 所以，意识开始展示它的全部。 然后就没有什么隐藏的东西。 内容，也就是，我们的伤害，贪婪， 嫉妒，我们的快乐，信仰，意识形态， 所有这些构成了我们的意识，过去的传统， 现在，科学的或者事实的传统，等等， 所有这些就是我们的意识。 观察它，没有任何思想的活动， 因为思想构建了意识的内容 ——思想构筑了它。 当思想介入然后说， “这是对的，这是错的，应该这样，应该那样……”， 你就仍然在意识的领域， 你并没有超越它。 所以，一个人必须理解，非常清楚地理解，思想的位置。 思想在知识的领域有它的位置， 在技术世界，等等。 但是，无论如何，思想在人的 心理结构中没有位置。 当思想运作时，就会有困惑， 然后就会有矛盾和所有的冲突， 关于你和其他人的意象，等等。 所以，这种艺术，就像我们说的，“艺术”这个词 意味着把所有事物放到它们正确的位置， 不是做一个画家，雕塑家或者诗人， 而是在我们的日常生活中，把所有事物放到它们正确的位置， 这就是艺术。 所以，你能观察你的意识， 让它揭示它的内容 ——不是一点一点地， 而是它整体的运动吗？ 然后，只有这样才有可能超越它。 不是通过分析，我们说过了， 因为分析意味着分析者和被分析之物， 意味着分裂，以及分裂中的时间的问题， 当你分析时，每一个分析必须都是彻底完整的。 如果有不完整的分析， 那这个分析的不完美， 就会延续到下一个分析中， 所以不完美会变得越来越多。 你明白吗？ 就像练习弹钢琴， 却总是练习弹错误的音。 对吗？ 所以，这就是我们的探索。
33:17 And, in enquiry, can you observe without any movement of the eye? Because the eye – the eye – has an effect on the brain. You can observe it for yourself. When you keep your eyeballs completely still, observation becomes very clear because the brain is quietened. You can experiment with this. This is not a trick for something further. It is like going to a guru and learning a few tricks. There is a lovely story, I must tell you about it. A young man goes to a guru, a teacher, and says, ‘Please tell me what truth is. I have searched everywhere and nobody seems able to tell me, and I’ve come to you. Please tell me what truth is.’ And the guru says, ‘Stay with me. Be with me.’ And so the pupil, the disciple, stays with him for about fifteen years watching him – you know, all the rest of it. At the end of fifteen years, he says, ‘Good Lord, I’ve learnt nothing.’ And so goes to the guru and says, ‘I am so sorry, you have taught me nothing. I haven’t found truth. I am going to leave you and go to that guru, the other one.’ And so, after five years, he comes back. He says, ‘At last, I have learnt.’ And the guru says, ‘What have you learnt?’ ‘You see that river? I can walk across it without a boat, without anything. I can tread on the water.’ And the guru says, ‘You can do that for twopence, if you take that little boat.’ Right? I think you should bear that story in mind, when you approach any gurus. 在探索中， 你能完全不移动眼睛的观察吗？ 因为眼睛会影响到头脑。 你能自己观察到这一点。 当你保持眼珠完全不动时， 观察就能很清晰， 因为大脑是安静的。 你可以自己实验这一点。 这不是某种为了其他更多事物的技巧。 就像跑到大师那里，学习一些技巧。 这里有一个可爱的小故事，我一定要告诉你们。 一个年轻人找到一个大师，说 “请告诉我真相是什么。 我找遍了所有地方，但是没人能告诉我， 然后我找到了你，请告诉我真相是什么。“ 大师说，”和我待在一起。“ 然后这个徒弟在大师身边待了十五年， 观察他，等等，你知道的。 十五年之后，他说， ”天呐。我什么都没有学到。” 然后跑去找大师说“我很抱歉， 你什么都没教我。我没有找到真相。 我要离开你，去找另一个大师了。“ 五年之后，他又回来了。 他说，”这次，我学到了。“ 大师问，“你学到什么了？” “你看到那条河了吗？，我能走过去， 不需要船，不需要任何东西，我能在水上行走。” 大师说，“只需要两便士， 你就能坐船过去。” 对吗？ 我认为你们应该把这个故事放在心里，当你接近任何大师的时候。
36:07 So, can you observe, without any movement of thought interfering with your observation? It is only possible when the observer realises that which he is observing is one – the observer is the observed. Anger is not different from me, I am anger, I am jealousy. So, there is no division between the observer and the observed. That is the basic reality one must capture. And to observe without the observer. Just to observe, then you will see the whole of consciousness, the whole of it begins to reveal itself without your making an effort. Which means, in that total observation, there is the emptying or going beyond all the things that thought has put together, which is our consciousness. The reality which thought has made, is not truth it is a reality of thought. We must go on. 所以，你能没有任何思想活动 干扰地观察吗？ 这只有当思想者认识到 他和他观察的东西没有区别——观察者就是被观察之物时，才能做到。 愤怒和你并无不同，我就是生气，我就是嫉妒。 所以，观察者和被观察之物中间没有分裂。 这是一个人必须接受的最基本的事实。 没有观察者的观察。 只是去观察， 然后你就会看到意识的整体， 开始揭示它自身，而完全不需要你的努力。 这就意味着，在全然的观察中， 就会清空或者超越所有， 思想构建的事物，也就是我们的意识。 思想构建的现实不是真相， 它只是思想的现实。 我们必须继续。
37:58 Then, to enquire into the problem of time not scientific fiction, but time, as psychologically a movement towards an object, towards an idea, towards an ideology. That is, one is greedy – I’m taking that – or violent. And one says to oneself, ‘I will take time to get over it,’ or to modify it, or to change it, or to get rid of it, or to go beyond it. That’ll take time. We are talking about that time, not the chronological time by the watch or by the sun, but this whole conditioning of our mind, which says, ’I will take time to achieve that which is essential, that which is beautiful, that which is good.’ We are questioning that time. You understand? Is there psychological time at all, or thought has invented that time? You are following? Please examine it. Look at it, without any distortion, this question, this challenge. You know, when you are challenged, unless you respond with all your energy, it’s not a challenge at all. You just pass it by. But if you respond to that challenge with all your energy, as we are doing now, whether there is a psychological time at all, all your energy is responding. All your energy is not responding if you’re trying to withhold something, say, ‘I must have a little time.’ ‘I was looking forward to meeting you, the day after tomorrow. Oh, my God, if there is no time, I’m lost. I love you, and all the rest of it, and if I don’t meet you in a week’s time, what’s going to happen?’ You follow? You’re following all this? This is the psychological time, which is hope. 现在要探究时间的问题， 不是科幻的时间， 而且是作为心理上朝着某个对象运动的时间， 朝着某个观点，某个意识形态。 比如，一个人是贪婪的，或者说是暴力的。 然后他对自己说，“我需要时间来克服它。” 或者去调整它，改变它， 或者放弃它，超越它。 这些都需要时间。 我们在谈论的不是， 钟表的时间，不是手表或者日升日落的时间， 而是我们意识的整个制约，意识说， “我需要时间去实现根本的， 美丽的，良善的事物。” 我们在质疑这种时间。你明白吗？ 存在心理上的时间吗， 或者这种时间是思想创造的？ 你跟上了吗？请探究这一切。 看着这个问题，这个挑战，而没有任何扭曲。 你知道，当你被挑战时， 除非你用你全部的能量回应， 否则它根本就不是一个挑战，你只是错过了它。 但是，如果你用你全部的能量去回应这个挑战， 就像我们现在做的， 是否存在心理时间， 用你全部的能量去回应。 但是你没有用你全部的能量回应， 如果你尝试去保留某事， 你说，“我必须要一点时间。” “我会在后天再来见你。 上帝，如果没有时间，我就迷失了。 我爱你，以及其他的一切， 如果一星期之内，我不能见到你， 会发生什么？”你明白吗？ 你跟上这一切了吗？ 这就是心理时间，也就是希望。
40:53 Are you, also, please, working together? We are working together. I am not working by myself. I can do this – I don’t do this in my room. There I’m quiet, something else takes – that’s not important. But we are sharing this thing, together, moving together. So, we are asking, as there is chronological time, that is, it takes time to learn a language, it takes time to learn how to drive a car, it takes time to learn mathematics, it takes time to learn certain specialities, to become a specialist. That same idea, that same thought says, ‘It will take time for me to evolve, to be good, or to become chief executive of some blasted business. So, is there such time? Please, this is very important because you are going to shatter, altogether, the idea of tomorrow, psychologically. Then it is a tremendous shock. You understand? If there is no psychological tomorrow, then what will you do with that which is? You understand the problem? If there is no time, then how is violence to end? Our conditioning is to use time as a means of getting rid slowly or quickly, or whatever it is, of violence. But if there is no time at all then what takes place when there is violence? Will there be violence? You understand my question? If one’s whole outlook is, psychologically, that there is no time at all, then is there a ‘me’ who is violent? You follow? The ‘me’ is put together through time. The ‘me’ is violence, is time. But if there is no time as thought, as ‘me,’ which is the process of tomorrow, then there is nothing, there is no violence. I wonder if you see this? You see, is love a matter of time? Is love a thing to be remembered – or having remembrance, and the pleasure of that remembrance, which you call love, which is time? Right? So, is love a matter of time, remembrance? If it is a matter of time, which is thought, then it, obviously, is not love. ‘I will love you, everlastingly’ – which is, of course, nonsense. But you take vows in the church, and you know, all that bilge. 你在和我一起工作吗？ 我们要一起工作。不是只有我自己来。 我可以自己做这些——我不会在我的房间做这些。 然后我就会安静下来，某些事就会发生——这不重要。 但是我们在共同分享这一切，共同前进。 所以，我们在问，存在钟表的时间， 也就是，学习一门语言需要时间， 学习开车需要时间， 学习数学需要时间， 学习某个特定领域的知识， 成为一个专家需要时间。 基于同样的观点，同一个思想会说， “我需要时间来进化，变得更好， 或者成为一些该死的生意公司的首席执行官。” 所以，存在这样的时间吗？ 请注意，这很重要 因为我们要粉碎，所有， 心理的明天的观点。 然后就会有巨大的震撼。你明白吗？ 如果没有心理上的明天， 那你会对现实做什么？ 你明白这个问题吗？ 如果没有时间，那么暴力要如何结束？ 我们的制约是用时间 作为摆脱的方法， 或快或慢的摆脱事实之是， 摆脱暴力。 但是如果完全没有时间， 那么当存在暴力时会发生什么？ 那样还有会暴力吗？你明白我的问题吗？ 如果一个人的整个观点是，在心理上 完全不存在时间， 那还会有“我”，也就是暴力吗？ 你明白吗？ “我”就是通过时间构建起来的。 “我”就是暴力，就是时间。 但是如果没有作为思想，作为“我”， 的时间，也就是明天的过程， 然后就什么都没有，就没有了暴力。 我好奇你是否看到了这一点？ 你看，爱是和时间相关的事吗？ 爱是一件被记忆——或者怀有记忆， 以及对那个记忆的快感吗？ 这也就是你所谓的爱，也就是时间。 对吗？ 所以，爱是时间的事吗？是记忆吗？ 如果，爱是时间的事，也就是思考， 那显然，它就不是爱。 “我将会永远爱你”——显然，毫无意义。 但是你在教堂发了誓，你知道所有那一切。
45:15 So, do we in our examination see very clearly that, psychologically, there is no time at all? If there is no time at all, there is no past or future, but only something else, totally different. I wonder if you see this! You see, we are conditioned to time. We say, psychologically, there must be evolution for me to become something other than what I am. And when you deny, when you see the truth of the fact that time is an invention of thought because thought itself has brought this time, then there is an ending of the past and the future. You understand? There is only the sense of timeless movement, now. I wonder if you see this! It’s really extraordinary, if you understand this. After all, love is that, isn’t it? Love is at the same level, at the same time, at the same intensity, at that moment, that is love – not the remembrance, or the future – that state of mind that is really, completely, without time, which is love. I wonder if you understand this! Then see what happens in our relationship, see what happens in our relationship with another. You, perhaps, have that extraordinary sense of love which is not of time, which is not of thought, which is not a remembrance of pleasure or pain, and what is the relationship between you, who have that, and another who hasn’t got that? You understand the problem? You have no image, because image is the movement of time, about another, time has built that, thought has built this image step by step, about another and the other has made an image about you, step by step, which is a movement of time. And you have no time at all, and, therefore, you have this extraordinary sense of love which is not of time, then what is your relationship with another? Do you understand? Work it out! Think it out. Go into it, you will see. 所以，在我们的探究中，我们是否真的非常清楚的看到， 心理上，完全没有时间这回事？ 如果完全没有时间，就没有过去或者未来， 而是只有某种完全不同的事物。 我好奇你是否看到了这一点！ 你看，我们都被时间所制约。 我们说，心理上，必然存在进化， 我们会变成某种不是我们现在样子的东西。 而当你否定，当你看到事实真相时， 也就是时间是思想的发明 因为思想本身，带来了时间， 然后就会有过去和，未来的终结。 你明白吗？ 只有没有时间的运动，现在。 我好奇你们是否看到了这一点！ 这太非凡了，如果你理解这一切。 毕竟，这就是爱，对吗？ 爱就是在同一个程度，同一个时间， 同样的强度，同一个时刻，这就是爱 ——不是记忆或者未来—— 而是那种完全，彻底地，没有时间的，头脑的状态， 也就是爱。我好奇你是否理解了？ 然后看看我们关系中发生了什么， 看看我们和他人的关系中发生了什么。 你，也许，有爱的非凡的感觉， 那不是时间也不是思想， 也不是对快感或者痛苦的记忆， 那拥有爱的你，和另一个 没有爱的人，关系是怎样的？ 你明白这个问题吗？ 你没有意象，因为意象是时间的运动， 关于其他人的意象， 时间构建了它，思想一步步构建起这个意象， 关于其他人的意象， 其他人也一步一步构建起关于你的意象， 这也是时间的运动。 而你没有任何时间， 因此，你有非凡的爱的感觉， 也就是没有时间， 那么你和其他人的关系是怎样的？ 你明白吗？ 把它想出来！探究它，你会看到的。
48:27 Then, what is the relationship between human beings? When you have that extraordinary quality of love, then in that quality there is supreme intelligence. Right? I wonder if you see this. That intelligence is going to act in that relationship, not you will act in that relationship. I wonder if you see this. I must get on. We can discuss this really marvellous thing you have to go into a great deal because it totally alters all relationship. Because if there is no alteration, fundamentally, in our relationship, there is no alteration in society because we have built this monstrous society. So, that is the whole nature of time. A man that is hoping, that hope is born out of despair, that despair is the past and the hope is the future and so he is caught in psychological time and there is no answer to that question, at all. 那么，人和人之间的关系是怎样的？ 当你有那种非凡的爱的品质， 那么在那种品质中，就有至高无上的智慧。 对吗？我好奇你是否看到了。 这种智慧就会在关系中运作， 不是你在关系中运作。 我好奇你是否看到了这一点。我必须继续了。 我们可以讨论这一件真的，非同寻常的事， 你必须深刻的理解它， 因为它会彻底的改变所有关系。 因为如果我们的关系没有根本的转变， 我们的社会也不会有根本的转变， 因为是我们构建了这个可怕的社会。 所以，这就是时间的整个本质。 一个人满怀希望，而这希望是出于绝望， 绝望是过去，希望是未来， 所以他被困在了心理时间里， 这样就完全无法回答那个问题。
49:51 So then, the next thing is – what is it? – space. Space. One wonders, what is space? Do you ever wonder what is space? Not some science writer about space, or who has intellectually thought-out and laid down in ideas, in words, what space is, but what is space? Can there be space without order? Can there be space in disorder? All right, let’s begin with this. We are enquiring, together. Please bear with me, if I repeat it over and over again that we are examining, moving, sharing this thing, together. 所以，下一件事是什么？ 空间 空间。 我好奇，什么是空间？ 你思考过什么是空间吗？ 不是科幻作家笔下的空间， 或者某个智力超群的人想象的空间， 基于想法，词语的空间， 那么什么是空间？ 没有秩序能有空间吗？ 失序时能有空间吗？ 好吧，让我们从这一点开始。 我们在一同探索。 请忍耐一下，如果我把这句话重复了太多次， 我们要一起探究，前进，分享这件事。
51:16 We are asking, is there space when there is disorder in a room? Just take the physical fact when you throw your clothes all over the place, and you know, messy, is there space? And that space can only come when you have put everything in its right place. Right? So, outwardly. Now, inwardly, our minds are so confused, our whole life is self-contradiction, disorder, caught in various habits, drugs, smoke, drink, sex – habits. Obviously, where there is habit, there is disorder, because habit is mechanical. So, we are going to find out what is order. Is order something dictated by thought? Because thought itself is a movement of disorder because it’s limited. Right? I wonder if you see this. We think we can bring about order socially by great, careful thought, which is the ideological movement. Right? Our society whether in the West or the East is in disorder, is confused, is contradictory – you sell arms to some people and then hope to have peace. You know, it’s all so totally mad, the world is – and we’re also mad, somewhat. The world is mad because we have made it mad. 我们问，当一个房间是失序的时，会有空间吗？ 只是看这个物理事实， 当你把衣服扔的到处都是， 你知道的，很混乱， 还会有空间吗？ 空间只有当你把 所有事物放到它们正确的位置上时才会出现。 对吗？当然，外在是这样。 现在，内在来说，我们的意识是如此困惑， 我们的整个生活都是自我矛盾，失序的， 困于各种各样的习惯， 毒品，吸烟，饮酒，性——这都是习惯。 显然，哪里有习惯，哪里就有失序， 因为习惯是机械的。 所以，我们要发现，秩序是什么， 秩序是某件思想指导的事吗？ 因为思想本身就是失序的运动， 因为它是受限的。 对吗？我好奇你是否看到了这一点。 我们认为我们能在社会层面带来秩序， 通过认真，仔细地思考， 也就是某种意识形态的活动。对吗？ 我们的社会，不管是在西方还是东方，都是失序的， 都是困惑，充满矛盾的——你向某些人出售武器， 然后希望拥有和平。 你知道，这整个世界是如此的疯狂 ——我们也都疯了。 这个世界是疯狂的，因为我们让它变得疯狂。
53:51 So, what is disorder, and what is order? We are saying, disorder comes outwardly when thought is in movement, in action, thought which is limited, fragmentary and divides the whole of life into fragments. You have seen that. Thought does this. Are we aware of this? Please, come on. That is, you are a business man, then if you’re not a business man, you are an artist, if you are not an artist, you are a doctor, a professor, or merely a gardener – you follow? All our life is divided, divided, divided. That is disorder. Where there is division there is disorder, and thought has brought about this division – class, nationality, heaven and hell – you know, all the rest of it. Thought has done this. So, where there is movement of thought, which is time-binding, which is fragmentary, in itself, therefore, limited in itself, wherever it acts, there must be total disorder. I wonder if you see this. No, don’t agree with me, please, it is not a question of agreeing with me. Do you see this in your life? 所以，什么是失序，什么是秩序？ 我们说，在思想活动时 会有外在的失序， 因为思想是受限的，碎片化的， 把整个生命分裂成碎片。 你已经看到了。思想做了这一切。 我们认识到这一点了吗？请跟上我。 例如，你是一个生意人， 如果你不是生意人，你就是一个艺术家， 如果你不是一个艺术家，你就是一个医生，一名教授， 或者只是一个园丁——你明白吗？ 我们的整个生活是分裂的，这就是失序。 哪里有分裂，哪里就有失序， 是思想带来了这种分裂 ——阶级的，国家的，天堂和地狱—— 你知道这一切。思想发明了这一切。 所以，哪里有思想的运动， 其本身就是受限于时间的，碎片化的， 因此，本身就是受限的，哪里有它的运动， 哪里就必然有失序。 我好奇你是否看到这一点了。 不，请不要同意我， 这不是同意的问题。 你在你的生命中看到这一切了吗？
55:35 So, if that is true, then what is order in relation to action? You understand? All our action, now, is based on thought, on conclusions, on memory. And we are saying, as long as thought, which is limited, which has created an ideology and acts according to that ideology, there must be total disorder. We are saying that, which is a fact, if you observe it in daily life. Then, what is action, in which there is no movement of thought? You understand? Is this all becoming too abstract? Questioner: No, no. 所以，如果这是真实的， 那么行动中的秩序是什么？ 你明白吗？ 现在我们所有的行动都是基于思想， 结论，或者记忆。 我们说，只要有思想，它是受限的， 它创造了意识形态，然后基于这种意识形态生活， 然后就必然有彻底的失序。 我们说，这是一个事实，如果你在你的日常生活中观察这一点。 那么，完全没有思想运动的行动是什么？ 你明白吗？ 这一切都太抽象了吗？提问者：没有。
56:40 K: It is not. To me, it’s boiling. It is not an abstraction, not intellectual amusement, either. 克：并没有，对我来说，它正在沸腾。 这不是一种抽象，或者智力的娱乐。
56:52 Is there an action which is not born out of the movement of thought, out of certain ideologies which have been put together by thought, or by memories, which again is the response of thought – is there an action totally free from thought? Such action, then, will be complete, whole, total. You understand? Not fragmentary, not contradictory, it’ll be the whole of action, in which there is no regret, no sense of, ‘I wish I hadn’t done that,’ or ‘I will do that.’ Right? This is what we are enquiring into. Disorder comes about when there is the movement of thought, and thought, itself, is fragmentary and when it acts, everything must be fragmentary. If one sees that, very clearly, then one asks, what is action, without thought? Action means the doing now, not tomorrow, or having done, doesn’t it? The meaning of that word is active present, acting, now. And, as we said, love is not of time. Right? Compassion is beyond the intellect, beyond memory, it is a state of mind, and that love, that compassion acts because that compassion, love, is supremely intelligent. So, intelligence then acts. You get… Are you getting some of this? Or it’s just words? 存在行动， 不是诞生于思想的运动， 不是诞生于某种思想构建的意识形态， 或者是记忆，记忆也是思想的反应 ——存在完全摆脱了思想的行动吗？ 这样的行动，才是彻底、完全、完整的行动。 你明白吗？不是碎片化的，不是自相矛盾的， 而是完整的行动，其中没有任何遗憾， 没有，“我希望，我没有做到，我将会做到”的感觉。 对吗？ 这就是我们要探究的东西。 当有思想的运动时，就会有失序， 思想本身就是碎片化的， 当它运作，任何事都会变得碎片化。 如果一个人非常清楚地看到这一点，一个人就会问， 没有思想的行动是什么？ 行动意味着现在做， 不是明天做，或是已经做过了，对吗？ 行动这个词意味着积极的，现在的行为。 就像我们说的，爱不是时间。 对吗？ 慈悲超出了智力和记忆， 它是思想的一种状态， 那种爱，慈悲，会运作， 因为慈悲，爱本身是非同寻常的智慧。 所以，智慧就会运作。你明白吗？ 你理解点什么没？或者这一切对你只是词语？
59:11 So, we can go into this, enormously. It’s like digging into the bottomless pit and there is water, always, so, we can go deeper and deeper and deeper – that’s irrelevant. So then, we are saying, order is space, this kind of order, which is action of intelligence, which is neither yours nor mine, which is intelligence, born out of love and compassion. Now, space implies a mind that is not occupied. But our minds are occupied all day long, about something or other. So, there is no space, or an interval between two thoughts. Every thought is associated with another thought. Look at it. Please, look at it. So, that there is no gap, when your whole mind is crowded, chattering, opinions, judgements, right, wrong, good – I am a rightist, I am a leftist, I am this, that. 所以，我们能极大地深入其中。 就像挖一个无底洞， 永远都会有水， 所以，我们能不断深入，不断深入——这无关紧要。 所以，我们说，秩序就是空间，这种秩序， 是智慧的行动，不是你的或者我的智慧， 是出于慈悲和爱的智慧本身。 现在，空间意味着思想不被占据。 但是我们的思想整日被某些事占据。 所以，其中没有空间，或者说两个思想中间没有间隔。 每一个思想都联系着另一个思想。 看一下这一切。请看一下。 所以，其中没有间隔， 当你的整个意识都被挤满，喋喋不休， 观点，判断，对的，错的，好的 ——我是右派，是左派，是这个，是那个。
1:00:51 So, order of the kind we have talked about, brings enormous space. Space means silence. Right? And out of silence comes this extraordinary sense of emptiness. Don’t be frightened by that word ‘empty’ because when there is emptiness then things can happen. You understand? Like a womb of a woman who bears a child, it is empty. Do you understand all this? 所以，我们谈论的秩序 会带来大量的空间。 空间意味着安静。 对吗？ 在安静中就会诞生非同寻常的空的感觉。 不要被“空”这个词吓到， 因为当存在空时，那些事就会发生。 你明白吗？ 就像女人的孕育孩子的子宫，就是空的。 你明白这一切吗？
1:01:47 So, then, we go on to the next thing – what was that? – beauty. What is beauty? Does it lie in a picture, in a museum, or in the poem of Keats? Does it lie in the line of the mountains against the sky, or in a sheet of water reflecting the heavens, the beautiful clouds? Or the line of an architect, a building? We are asking, what is beauty? You understand? Come on, sirs, go into yourself, find out. The form, that has a certain beauty. We are enquiring into what is beauty, not the imagination that creates beauty, not the word that creates the beauty, not a beautiful idea, but what is beauty, when you see something extraordinarily alive and beautiful like a mountain, a clear sky, blue, at that moment, when you see it, totally, you are absent, aren’t you? I wonder if you’ve realised it. Because of its immensity, its extraordinary stability, its extraordinary sense of – you know – firmness, and the line of it, that magnificence drives away the ‘me,’ for the moment. And you say, ‘How extraordinary!’. Please listen, carefully – which is, the outer glory has driven away the petty little ‘me.’ Right? Like a boy, like a child, give him a toy and he is absorbed by that toy. Right? And he will play with it for an hour and break it up, and when you take away the toy, he is back to himself, naughty, crying, mischievous, all the rest of it. So, the same thing has happened. The great mountain has driven away the petty little ‘me,’ and you see it for the moment. That is, when the ‘me’ is absent totally, there is beauty. Get it? Come on, sirs. Not in the drum, not in the folk songs, not in the latest songs, on television they have it, I’ve forgotten – rock, that’s it! You are carried away by all that, but you never find out, for yourself, what is beauty because without beauty there is no love not the beauty of a form, a face, curly hair, tall, short, black, whatever it is, but the beauty that comes when there is no ‘me.’ The ‘me’ that has been put together by thought, the ‘me’ that is the movement of time. And that is beauty. We can go into it much more deeply because then your relationship to nature changes, completely. Then earth becomes precious – you understand? – every tree, every leaf, everything is part of that beauty. But man is destroying everything. 所以，让我们探究一下下一个问题，美。 美是什么？ 美存在于一幅画中， 博物馆中， 或者济慈的诗中吗？ 美在映衬着天空的群山中， 或者在倒映着天空，美丽云朵的水面上吗？ 或者在宏伟建筑的线条中？ 我们问，什么是美？ 你明白吗？来吧先生，请自己找出来。 形式有某种美。 我们在探究什么是美， 不是产生美的形象， 不是产生美的词语， 不是一个美丽的想法， 而是什么是美，当你看到某样极度鲜活， 美丽的事物，就像一座山，清澈湛蓝的天空， 在那一瞬间，当你看到它的整体，你就不在了，对吗？ 我好奇你是否认识到这一点。 因为它的浩瀚，它非凡的稳定感， 它的非凡的——你知道的——坚定， 它的线条， 那种壮丽暂时驱散了“我“。 然后你说，”太壮观了！”。 请认真听—— 也就是， 外在的壮丽驱散了小小的“我“。 对吗？ 就像一个小男孩，给他一个玩具， 他就被那个玩具吸引了。 对吗？ 他会玩上一个小时，然后把它弄坏， 当你把玩具拿走时，他就又回到了自身， 变得淘气，哭闹等等。 所以，是同样的事情。 壮丽的山峰驱散了小小的”我“， 然后你看了一会。 也就是，当”我“彻底不在时，就会有美。 明白了吗？来吧，先生。 美不在鼓声，乡村音乐，或者最新的流行歌中， 或者电视节目里，我忘了叫什么了 ——摇滚，对，就是它！ 你们被这一切所吸引， 但是你从不为自己搞清楚， 什么是美， 因为没有美，就没有爱， 不是某种型式的美，脸蛋，卷发， 长头发，短头发，黑头发等等的美， 而是当”我“不存在时的美。 这个”我“是由思想构建的， 这个”我“是时间的运动。 那样才是美。 我们可以再讨论的深入一些， 因为那样你和自然的关系会彻底改变。 然后大地就变得珍贵——你明白吗？—— 每一颗大树，每一片叶子，所有事物都是那种美的一部分。 但是人类正在摧毁这一切。
1:06:54 So, then we are asking, is there anything sacred, holy? Obviously, the things that thought has put together in a church – in a church, not the building, which is also the result of thought – everything that thought has put together in the religious sense, or in the psychological sense, and investing sacredness in an image, in an idea, is that sacred at all? If it is sacred, then it has no division – you’re not a Christian then, nor a Hindu, nor a Buddhist, Muslim and all the rest of the division. So, that which thought has put together, is of time, is fragmentary, is not whole, therefore, it is not holy. Though you worship the image on a cross, that’s not holy, that’s put together by thought – or the image that the Hindus have put together, or the Buddhists and so on. So, what then is sacred? Because without finding that out, not being told, not wanting that sacredness because that gives an enormous vitality, enormous strength to life. Without that, life becomes very shoddy, empty, meaningless. So, one has to go into this question and find out. And you can only find out when thought has discovered – please listen – when thought has discovered, for itself, its right place. Therefore, without effort, without will, there is this immense sense of silence – silence of the mind, without any movement of thought. It’s only when the mind is absolutely free and silent then you discover that which is beyond all words, which is timeless. And all this is meditation. How can you meditate when you’re angry, when your life is based on violence, when in yourself there is contradiction? So, one has to put order there, first. The very process of putting order is part of meditation. You understand? Not to have conflict between two human beings, man, woman, never to have conflict. And to find out how to live without conflict, that’s part of meditation. Then, out of that, comes the enormity of what is true meditation. Finito! 所以，我们问， 存在某种神圣的事物吗？ 显然，思想在教堂中构建的 ——在教堂里，不只是建筑本身，那也是思想的结果—— 任何思想构建的所谓宗教的事物， 或者在心理学意义上， 在一个图像，一种观点中构建的神圣感， 这些是神圣的吗？ 如果它是神圣的，那么它就没有分裂 ——你不是一个基督徒，印度教徒或者佛教徒， 或者穆斯林等等，这都是一种分裂。 所以，思想创造的事物源于时间， 是碎片化的，不是完整的，因此，不是神圣的。 虽然你崇拜十字架上的那个形象，但那不是神圣的， 它是思想构建的， ——或者印度教徒构建的意象， 或者佛教徒的，等等。 所以，那么什么是神圣的？ 因为如果没有发现它，不是被告知， 不是想要神圣的事物，因为它能带给你巨大的活力， 带给生命巨大的力量。 没有它，生活会变得非常劣质，空洞，没有意义。 所以，一个人必须探究这个问题，然后发现它。 而你只能在思想认识到 ——请认真听——当思想认识到， 它自身正确的位置时，才可以。 因此，没有努力，没有愿望， 就会有巨大的安静的感觉 ——意识的安静，没有任何思想的活动。 只有当意识完全自由并且安静时， 你才能发现那超越所有词语， 与时间无关的事物。 而这一切就是冥想。 你如何能冥想，当你生气时， 当你的生命基于暴力， 当你自己陷入矛盾时？ 所以，一个人必须首先实现秩序。 实现秩序的过程就是冥想的一部分。 你明白吗？ 不要在两个人类间发生冲突， 男人，女人，永远不要冲突。 去发现如何能不带着冲突生活， 这就是冥想的一部分。 然后，从此之中，就会诞生真正的冥想的浩瀚。 结束了！
1:11:15 Right, sirs. 就是这样，各位先生。