Krishnamurti Subtitles
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MA7879T1 - 团体组织并没有拯救人类
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| 1:23 I suppose I have to talk. I'm glad it's a nice evening. We have seven talks and a couple of discussions, and we should go into all of our human problems as deeply as we can. But I think we should be very clear right from the beginning what you and I are doing together. | 1:23 我想我必须开始演讲了。 我很高兴，这是一个美好的夜晚。 我们一共有七次演讲和几次讨论会， 而我们将会尽可能深入地探讨 所有我们人类的问题。 但我认为我们从一开始就应该 非常清楚 你和我正在一起做些什么。 |
| 2:21 First of all, I would like to point out, if I may, that this is not a propaganda, not a new set of ideas, a new set of beliefs, or setting oneself as a guru, but together we are going to talk over our many problems. The implications in talking over together are that as there are so many of you one cannot possibly communicate with each one, but if we are able to think together, not agreeing or disagreeing, but able to think clearly, objectively, sanely, and that implies that you are not prejudiced, that you don't start out with a lot of opinions, judgements, opposing arguments. We are not dealing with arguments, or with opinions. We are trying, actually doing, trying to find out a way of life in which we understand the total complexity of our lives. | 2:21 首先，如果可以的话，我想要指出的是： 这并不是一次政治宣传活动， 不是要宣扬传播一套新的思想理念， 一套新的信仰， 或者某人要自诩为古鲁， 而是我们将要一起来 讨论我们的诸多问题。 这里“一起讨论”的含义是： 因为你们这里人很多， 某人（指克氏自己）是不可能 和每一个人单独交流的， 但如果我们能够一起去思考， 不是去同意或者不同意， 而是能够去清晰地、 客观地、理智地思考 ——这意味着你 没有心怀偏见， 你并没有从一开始就 带着大量的观点、 判断、相反的论点。 我们并不是在处理论点或观点。 我们正在试着真正地去行动， 试着去发现一种生活方式， 通过它我们可以理解 我们生活全部的错综复杂。 |
| 4:42 So, if I may point out that to think together implies, does it not, that you approach the problems, that you approach without any previous conclusions, previous ideas, or beliefs. We are thinking together. And that implies that you must exercise your brains and not go to sleep, not accept. | 4:42 所以，如果允许我指出这一点的话： 那就是“一起思考”就意味着 你去处理那些问题， 而你处理问题时， 并没有带着任何过去的结论、 过去的观点，或者信仰。 对吧？ 我们是在一起思考。 而这意味着你必须要运用你的大脑， 不要昏昏欲睡，也不要接受（我的观点）。 |
| 5:45 First of all, we must look at the problems that surround us, both outwardly and inwardly. We must first examine clearly what the outward things are, what is going on in the world. Because we have to think globally, not provincially, not with a class mind or a sectarian mind, believing in one thing and contradicting what you believe by your actions, and so on. So we are together examining, clearly if we can, what is happening in the world, outside us, not only environmentally, but politically, religiously, ecologically. 7:07 Because if you don't examine the outside accurately as far as one can, it is very difficult to examine oneself accurately. You must begin with the outer and come inwards, like a tide that goes out and comes in. It is the same movement, the world outside us is not different from us. But at least we can clearly observe what is happening around us. And we have at least a criteria from which we can work inwardly. I hope that is clear. | 5:45 首先，我们必须要看到 存在于我们周围的那些问题 ——既包括外在的问题，也包括内心的问题。 我们首先必须要清楚地去检视 我们外在的那些事物， 以及这个世界上正在发生着的事情。 因为我们必须要以“全球性的思维”去思考， 而不是以“地方性的思维”、 以阶级划分的思维、或者宗派主义的思维去思考， 信仰某个东西， 然而自己的行为却与这种信仰背道而驰，等等。 所以我们正在一起检视， 尽可能清楚地去检视 这个世界、我们外在 正在发生的事情， 不只是周遭环境的变化， 也包括政治上、宗教上、 生态上发生的事情。 7:07 因为如果你没有尽己所能地 去准确地检视外部的世界， 那么要准确地检视自己 就会变得相当困难。 你必须要从外在开始， 然后再深入内在， 就像潮水一样，先出去、再进来。 它是同一个运动， 我们外在的世界和「我们」并没有什么不同。 但至少，我们是可以清楚地观察到 我们周围正在发生的事情的。 而我们也至少可以有一个「标准」， 我们可以靠它来进行「内在的工作」。 我希望这点已经说清楚了。 |
| 8:01 First, we are together going to examine what is happening around us, in every possible way, if we can, with the facts which we have. And we have not many facts because we are dealing with politicians, with so-called rulers, right throughout the world. And they are governing us. And if you observe each country, a group of people are concerned about their own little area. This is obvious. And if you further examine, not only they are concerned with their own little area of a vast field, which is the world, but also that little area is broken up, fragmented more and more and more. | 8:01 首先，我们要一起去 检视我们周围世界正在发生的事情， 如果可以的话，用一切可能的方式去检视， 基于我们所了解到的事实去检视。 但我们并没有了解到多少事实， 因为我们所面对的是那些政客， 那些所谓的“统治者”， 全世界各地的“统治者”。 这些人正在统治/控制我们。 而如果你去观察一下每一个国家， （你会发现）一个特定的群体在关心着 他们自己的那一块小地盘。 这是显而易见的。 而如果你进一步去检视它的话， （你会发现）不只是这些人在关心着 自己的那块小地盘 ——这块地盘非常广阔，它就是这个世界。 同样的，这块“小地盘”， 它也是四分五裂的， 它正在变得越来越支离破碎。 |
| 9:19 So, there is fragmentation going on in the world, nationally, religiously, politically, economically. Breaking up. It is so obvious in this country, and in the rest of the world. So, there is fragmentation, not only politically, but also within oneself. We are broken up human beings, we are not whole. That's clear. And each nation is fighting the other nation - the Hindu, the Muslim, and so on, so on, so on. And one has relied, one has hoped that politics will save man. And it has not saved man. On the contrary, it has brought about much more suffering through wars, through division. 10:44 One has hoped through science man would break through. And that also has failed, economically, and so on. We have relied on politics for the saving of man, we have relied on religions for the saving of man, we have relied on science, which is the accumulation of knowledge in action, we have relied on that, and none of these have helped man. They may have given man a little corner somewhere or other, but it has been a constant struggle. Which is obvious. | 9:19 所以这种分裂的过程 正在全世界发生着， 国家的分裂、宗教的分裂、 政治上的分裂、经济上的分裂。 四分五裂，支离破碎。 在这个国家（印度）， 以及世界上的其他地方， 这种现象（分裂）都是显而易见的。 因此，存在着这种「分裂」， 不只是政治上的分裂， 也包括我们内心的分裂。 我们是“支离破碎”的人类， 我们并不是「完整合一」的。 这也是很显然的。 每一个国家都在和别的国家战斗 ——印度教徒对抗穆斯林，等等 等等。 而我们依靠……我们曾经希望 「政治」可以拯救人类， 然而它并没有拯救人类。 相反，它通过战争、通过分裂， 给我们带来了更多的苦难。 10:44 我们曾经希望通过「科学」， 人类会有所突破。 但「科学」同样也失败了， 「经济」也失败了，等等。 我们曾经依赖于「政治」来拯救人类， 我们曾依赖「宗教」来拯救人类， 我们还曾经依赖「科学」 ——「科学」就是在行动中积累知识， 我们曾经依赖于这些东西， 然而它们中没有一个能帮到人类。 它们或许给予了人类 某个小小的角落作为栖息之地， 但人类一直都在持续不断地斗争对抗。 这是显而易见的。 |
| 11:38 And we have also seen that no organisation of any kind, whether of the left, the right, the centre, the communist, the socialist - no organisation of any kind is going to save man. Right? I hope you will see that. Even small communities are not going to save man because it is a world problem, a global problem, and it must be dealt with globally, with a global mind, not with a little sectarian, parochial, narrow little mind. | 11:38 而我们同样也看到：那就是没有任何组织团体 ——不管它是左派、右派、中间派， 还是共产主义者、 社会主义者——没有任何组织团体 可以拯救人类。 对吧？ 我希望你们能看到这一点。 即使那些「小型社区」也无法拯救人类， 因为这是一个全世界的问题， 一个全球性的问题， 所以我们必须要从全世界的角度， 以“全球性的思维”去处理它， 而不是用一个渺小狭隘的宗派主义、 地方主义的头脑去处理它。 |
| 12:30 So, organisations have failed. Institutions have failed. The gurus multiplying like so many, what shall we say - mushrooms? - all over the world, and they are not going to save man. On the contrary, they make their own little whirlpool, little noise, little - you know what they are doing so I don't have to tell you all that. So, what is going to save man, because we are now, when you observe what is happening in the world, - preparation for war, 400 thousand million dollars are spent on armaments every year by all the governments. All the governments put together are spending 400,000 million dollars every year. That is totally insane. Right? | 12:30 所以，各类组织已经失败了。 各类机构团体也失败了。 无数“古鲁”冒了出来，就像…… 怎么说来着？ 就像雨后春笋般地 在全世界各地冒出来了， 可他们也拯救不了人类。 恰恰相反， 他们制造出了他们自己的 小骚乱、小噪音、 小……——你们都知道他们在做些什么， 就不用我来告诉你们了。 那么，什么东西可以拯救人类呢？ 因为如今我们正在…… ——如果你观察一下 这个世界上正在发生的事情 ——（你会发现）我们正在为战争做准备， 全球所有的政府每年花在军备武器上的开销 高达4000亿美元。 全世界所有政府加起来， 他们每年总共要花费 4000亿美元。 这完全是疯了。 对吧？ |
| 13:54 So when you see all this, what is man to do? You understand my question? What are you to do? Where shall we start with the reformation of man? We have tried every way to resolve this problem. We have had principles, extraordinary ideals, great theories, volumes of sacred books - so-called sacred books, no book is sacred, including the Gita, the Upanishads, or the Bible, or even the Koran. | 13:54 所以当你看到了这一切后， 一个人应该怎么做呢？ 你们理解我的问题吗？ 你该怎么做呢？ 我们应该从哪里入手 去开启人类的改革呢？ 我们已经尝试过所有各类方法 去解决这个问题。 我们有各种道德/行为准则， 非凡的理想， 伟大的理论， 浩如烟海的圣书——所谓的“圣书”， 但没有什么书是神圣的， 包括《薄伽梵歌》、《奥义书》或者《圣经》， 甚至是《可兰经》。 |
| 14:55 So, we have tried everything to resolve our problems, the Mao people in China, Lenin and his group in Russia, the Capitalists, the Socialists, the Liberals - every way we have tried. So, in looking at all this, with all their divisions and fragmentations, with their confusion, and every human being against another human being, one guru against another guru, 'my guru is better than yours, he is more peaceful than yours, he knows and you don't know,' and so on, and on, and on. I hope you realise how serious all this is. | 14:55 所以，我们已经尝试过了一切办法 来解决我们的各种问题， 中国那些信仰毛泽东的人， 列宁和他在俄罗斯的团体， 资本主义者、社会主义者、自由主义者 ——我们已经尝试过了每一种途径。 因此，在看到了这一切后， 看到了人类所有的分裂、支离破碎、 混乱困惑， 每一个人都在对抗着另一个人， 一个古鲁在对抗着另一个古鲁， “我的古鲁要比你的古鲁更好， 他要比你的古鲁更加平静， 他开悟了，而你的古鲁没有开悟”， 等等，等等。 我希望你们能意识到 这一切有多么的严重危急。 |
| 16:05 So, this is not a gathering of an evening which you casually attend and forget. We are gathered for a serious purpose. And that serious quality depends on you, whether you are being challenged, whether you accept the challenge, or you just pass it by. Various cultures have failed, including the culture of this country. So when you observe all these outward signs of violence, terrorism, brutality, enormous cruelty and torture, and politicians fighting for power, and so on, when you see all this and you are challenged: what is a human being to do? 17:30 What are you to do? Where do you begin? Because man, human beings like you and me, we are now facing a great crisis of humanity. I do not know if you realise it. And we must respond to that crisis, which is a challenge, accurately. | 16:05 所以这并不是一次晚间的聚会， 你可以随便地来参加一下， 然后就把它给忘了。 我们聚集在一起是为了一个严肃的目的。 而这种严肃认真的品质取决于你， 你是否正在受到挑战， 你是否接受这种挑战， 或者你只是听过就算了。 各种文明都已经失败了， 包括这个国家（印度）的文明。 所以当你观察到所有这些外在的迹象 ——暴力、 恐怖主义、暴行、 惊人的残忍与折磨， 政客们正在争夺权力， 等等，当你看到了所有这些， 你受到了挑战：作为一个人，该怎么做呢？ 17:30 你该怎么做呢？ 你要从哪里开始呢？ 因为人类——像你和我这样的人， 我们现在正面临一场重大的人类危机。 我不知道你是否意识到了这点。 而我们必须要对这场危机 作出准确的反应 ——这场危机就是一个挑战。 |
| 18:11 So, realising all this, who is going to save man? You understand my question? Who is going to save you, to save you from your confusion, from your conflict, from your suffering, from your constant contradictions, from your envy, from your petty nationalism - you understand? - from the gurus which you have accepted with their authority? So, when you observe this, surely, there is only one answer. Since organisations have no value any more, since leaders cannot help us, since no book is going to give freedom to each one of us, so, one can only begin with oneself. Right? I hope we are in communication with each other. 19:52 Communication implies sharing; sharing in our thinking, in our feeling, in observing what is going on, and demanding of ourselves the highest capacity to act correctly. So, from the outward we are moving inward. Right? It is the same movement, the world is not different from us. We have made this miserable world. Right? We have made it. No gods, no external agency, we human beings have created this society in which we live, with all its corruption, with all its malignant superstitions, with all its absurd gods. We have made this. The national class divisions. Please see all this. | 18:11 所以，在明白了这一切后， 谁将会来拯救人类呢？ 你理解我的问题吗？ 谁会来拯救你呢？ 拯救你脱离你的混乱困惑、 你的冲突、你的痛苦、 你持续不断的自相矛盾、 你的妒忌、你那卑微的国家主义 ——你理解了吗？ —— 脱离那些你已经接受认可的古鲁及其权威。 所以当你观察到这些以后， 毫无疑问，它只有一个答案。 由于各类组织团体已经不再有任何价值了， 由于领袖们无法帮到我们， 由于没有什么书籍可以给予 我们每个人「自由」， 因此，我们只能够从自己开始。 对吧？ 我希望我们正在彼此交流着。 19:52 「交流」意味着「分享」； 分享我们的思考， 分享我们的感受， 分享我们对于正在发生的事情的观察， 并要求我们自己具有那种 能够去正确行动的至高的能力。 所以我们从外在转向了内在。 对吧？ 这是同一个运动， 这个世界和我们并没有什么不同。 是我们创造出了这个痛苦不幸的世界。 是吧？ 是我们创造了它。 并不是什么神明、 什么外在的媒介创造了它， 而是我们人类自己创造出了 这个我们所生活于其中的社会 及其所有的腐败堕落， 所有恶意的迷信， 所有荒谬的神明。 我们已经创造出了这一切。 国家的、阶级的划分。 请看到这一切。 |
| 21:22 So, we must begin with ourselves. Right? Nobody on earth, or in heaven, is going to save us. No book, no guru, no system, no method, no leader, no hero, no principle. Right? We have to begin with ourselves and see if we can transform ourselves, if we can change radically from the very root of our being, so that we have a free mind, not a mind that is broken up, corrupt, fearful, anxious, greedy, in sorrow. So is that possible? You understand my question? Right, sir? Am I making this clear? Is the speaker making this clear? | 21:22 所以我们必须要从自己开始。 对吧？ 在这个地球上或者天国里， 都没有任何人能拯救我们。 没有任何书籍、古鲁、体制、方法， 没有任何领袖、英雄、行为/道德准则可以拯救我们。 对吧？ 我们必须要从我们自己开始， 去看看我们是否能够转变我们自己， 我们是否能够从根本上改变， 从我们「存在」的根源处改变， 由此我们便能拥有一个自由的头脑， 而不是一个分裂的、腐败的、 充满恐惧、焦虑、贪婪和痛苦的头脑。 那么，这可能吗？ 你们理解我的问题吗？ 你想说什么，先生？ 我是否已经把这点说清楚了？ 演讲者是否已经把它表述清楚了？ |
| 22:52 So, to go very far you must begin very near. 'Very near' is you. That's why we are asking: what is the quality of your thought, what is the quality of your mind that is willing, seeing what is happening, demanding that it must change the society in which we live, a different kind of education, different kinds of global government, and so on, so on. So, are we as human beings, you, willing or desirous, or deeply serious to find out, to investigate the whole human structure, psychological and religious, to see if it is possible for every human being who is good enough to listen to all this, whether he can investigate into himself. You understand, sirs? Right? | 22:52 所以，千里之行 始于足下。 这里的“足下”就是「你自己」。 所以我们才要问： 你思想的品质是怎样的？ 当你有了这种意愿时， 你的头脑具有什么样的品质？ 看到了正在发生的事情， 它必须要有所改变了， 去改变我们所生活于其中的这个社会， 我们需要有一种不同的教育， 一种不同的“全球性政府”， 等等 等等。 所以作为人类，我们、你们 是否愿意、或者渴望、 或者极度认真地想要去发现和探究 人类的整个结构 ——心理上的、和宗教上的结构—— 然后去看看 对于每一个足够良善 从而愿意聆听这一切的人来说， 他是否可能去深入探究他自己。 你们理解了吗，先生们？ 对吧？ |
| 24:48 So I am asking: what is the state of your mind, your consciousness that is willing, that is serious enough to investigate? You understand my question? Are you serious? Or you want to spend a pleasant evening under the trees, not that it is not beautiful after the rains, the clear sky, but do you know for yourself the state of your own existence, your daily existence, the way you think, what you feel, whether you are greedy, envious, and all the rest of it, the whole human structure. 26:04 Are you aware of it? Do you know what you think? And why you think? Do you know your feelings, your prejudices, your anxieties, your fears, which is our life, our daily life? Your relationship with another, intimate or otherwise, what that relationship is, whether it is superficial or deeply real. Or is it merely sexual, sensory, or in your relationship there is affection, care, tenderness, love? | 24:48 所以我在问：你的头脑状态是怎样的， 你的意识状态是怎样的 ——当你有这样的意愿， 并且足够认真地想要去探究时。 你们明白我的问题吗？ 你们是认真的吗？ 还是说你们想要在树下 度过一个令人愉快的夜晚， 并不是说雨后晴朗的天空就不美丽了， 而是你自己是否清楚 你自身的存在状态， 你的日常生活， 你的思考方式，你所感受到的东西， 你是不是贪婪的、嫉妒的，等等这一切， 人类的整个结构。 26:04 你们觉察到它了吗？ 你知道自己在想些什么吗？ 为什么你要想它？ 你知道自己的感受、自己的偏见、 自己的焦虑和恐惧吗？ 这些东西就是我们的生活、 我们的日常生活。 你和他人的关系， 不管这种关系是否亲密， 也不管那是什么样的关系， 它是肤浅表面的，还是真情实感的。 或者那种关系仅仅只是 性方面的、感官方面的， 或者说，在你的关系中 也有着感情、关爱、柔情和爱意？ |
| 27:07 So, we are asking whether you are aware of your own daily life with all its complexities. And it is only from there one can start, not with some belief, with some ideal, with some conclusions, belief in Brahman, or god, or Jesus, or something or other. Those are all illusions. So one is asking - please listen - one is asking if your mind is caught in an illusion. If it is, you cannot possibly bring about a radical change in yourself, because you're the world, you're not different from the rest of humanity, because you suffer, and the people living 10,000 miles away suffer. 28:35 They are afraid as you are afraid. They seek security and find very little of it, both in the world and psychologically, there is very little security. They want happiness - they are unhappy. They are gullible, like you. So, you are essentially similar to another human being. It is not an intellectual concept, to argue about - it is a fact. You may be brown, or black, or white, or pink, but apart from racial division every human being throughout the world goes through what you go through psychologically, and physically. 29:44 Isn't that so? You are afraid of death, and so are the others. You believe in reincarnation because that gives comfort, others have their own theories about afterlife. It is exactly like every other human being in the world. So you are essentially the world. | 27:07 所以，我们正在问： 你是否觉察到了 自己的日常生活及其所有的错综复杂。 而我们只能从这里开始， 而不是从某个信仰、某个理想、某些结论开始， 信仰「梵」、信仰「神」、信仰「耶稣」， 信仰这个或那个。 所有这些东西都是幻想。 所以某人正在问——请听好了—— 某人正在问：你的头脑是否正陷入于幻想中？ 如果是的，你就不可能为自己 带来一次根本性的转变， 因为「你就是这个世界」， 你和其他的人并没有什么区别， 因为当你受苦时， 那个生活在距你一万英里地方的人也在受苦。 28:35 就像你会害怕一样，他们也会害怕。 他们也在寻找「安全」，虽然找不到什么安全， 不管是在外部世界中， 还是内心世界里，都没有多少「安全」可言。 他们想要幸福，因为他们不幸福。 他们也很容易受骗上当——就像你们一样。 所以，从本质上来说， 你和其他的人是类似的。 这并不是一个思想智力上的观念， 可以去争论辩驳——它是一个事实。 你或许是棕色皮肤的人，或者是黑人，或者白人， 或者是粉色皮肤的人， 但抛开种族的区分， 全世界的每一个人， 他都在经历着你所经历着的一切 ——不管是内心的经历，还是外在身体上的经历。 29:44 难道不是这样吗？ 你害怕死亡，其他人也会害怕。 你相信“轮回转世”，因为它给你带来了安慰， 而其他人也会有他们自己关于「来世」的理论。 你的情况和世界上任何其他人 是完全一样的。 所以你本质上来说就是这个世界。 |
| 30:20 But the realisation of it is not an intellectual affair. It is not an idea, however good or bad. Unless you feel it with all your blood, and brain, and guts, that you are the world, therefore to bring about a change in the world you have to change radically. Right? Can we start from there? Which means, is one aware, know one's thoughts, one's feelings, one's beliefs, one's ideals, one's corruption, one's fears, pleasures, and all that, do you know all that? If you do, or if you don't, one has to investigate why we live as we are living, why we accept to live this way. Do you understand my questions? | 30:20 但要了悟到这一点，它并不是一件 思想智力上的事情。 它并不是一个观点 ——不管它是好是坏。 当你从骨子里、从头脑中、 发自肺腑地感受到了这一点 ——即「你就是这个世界」， 那么，要改变这个世界， 你自己就必须要彻底地转变。 没错吧？ 我们可以从这里开始吗？ 这意味着：我们是否觉察到了、 是否知晓了自己的想法念头、 自己的各种感受、 自己的信仰、理想、堕落、恐惧、 快感，等等这一切， 你知晓这一切了吗？ 你可能知晓了， 或者你还没有知晓， 那么你就必须要去探究 为什么我们要像现在这样子生活， 为什么我们要接受这种生活方式。 你们理解我的问题了吗？ |
| 32:10 So, we are together, and I mean together, we are together going to examine, explore, into ourselves. And this isn't a group therapy, which is an abomination, exposing each other's faults, and hoping thereby to clear up something. We are going to talk over together, examine the quality of our minds, the quality of our hearts, the quality of our brain. To examine you must be free to look. Right, sirs? Free to look into yourself. That means there must be no conclusion. Right? There must be no sense of authority. There must be no person who will tell you how to look, because then you look according to him. There must be no guide. You must be free to listen to yourself, to observe yourself, and learn as you observe, and act as you observe. | 32:10 所以，我们正在“一起” 我的意思是“一起”， 我们将要一起去检视、去探索我们自身。 这并不是一次「团体心理治疗」， 「团体心理治疗」是令人厌恶的东西， 彼此互相暴露自己的缺点过错， 希望由此来消除掉一些东西。 我们将要一起来讨论、 检视我们自己头脑的品质， 我们心灵的品质， 我们大脑的品质。 而要去检视它， 你就必须能够自由地去观察。 对吧，先生们？ 自由地去审视你自己。 这意味着我们必须没有结论。 对吧？ 必须没有什么权威感。 绝不能有某个人来告诉你“如何去观察”， 因为那样的话，你就是在根据他的方法来观察了。 我们必须没有任何向导。 你必须要能够自由地聆听你自己、 观察你自己， 并在你观察的时候去学习， 在你观察的时候去行动。 |
| 34:13 So we have this problem first: to know what actually is going on, what is happening now in your minds and hearts, in your daily life. And to be able to listen to your own mutterings, your own fears, your own miseries, to listen to it. And to observe in your relationship with another the reactions, because that is the only guide. Your reactions with another, how you have respect for those who are above you, or have better position, status, power, and those below you whom you kick. Right? 35:19 You see that in this country, this total lack of care, respect for human beings. So you have to find out for yourself by thinking over together, as we are doing now, how to observe yourself. Not what to think, but how to think. Not my way of thinking, or your way of thinking, or the professor, or the guru, or the specialist, but thinking together without any prejudice, without any opinion. Right? Otherwise you cannot think together. 36:25 Right? Do we see this? Do we see that you have an opinion, and I have an opinion, our thinking is distorted. Right? So is it possible to think without opinion? Please go into it with me, I am going to go slowly into it. Is it possible to observe without any conclusion? Is it possible to listen purely without any distortion? So we are going to go into that slowly, step by step. | 34:13 所以我们首先有了这个问题： 那就是要去知晓实际在发生的事情， 在你的头脑和心灵中，在你的日常生活中， 此时此刻，正在发生什么事情。 并且能够去倾听你自己喃喃自语、 你自己的恐惧、你自己的痛苦不幸， 去聆听它。 并且去观察存在于你和他人关系中的各种「反应」， 因为这才是唯一的向导。 你对于别人的反应， 你是如何尊重那些“在你之上”的人的， 或者那些拥有更高的地位、身份和权力的人， 你又是如何一脚踢开 那些“在你之下”的人的。对吧？ 35:19 你看到在这个国家里，人们完全缺乏 对于「人」的关爱与尊重。 所以你们必须要通过“一起认真思考” ——就像我们正在做的那样—— 亲自去搞清楚这一切， 如何去观察你自己。 不是“该思考什么”，而是“如何去思考”。 不是我的思维方式，或者你的思维方式， 或者某个教授、古鲁、专家的思维方式， 而是「一起去思考」，没有任何偏见、 没有任何观点意见。 对吧？否则的话，你们是无法一起去思考的。 36:25 是吧？我们是否看到了这点？ 我们是否看到了：你有着一种观点看法， 我也有着一种观点看法， 所以我们的思考就扭曲变形了。 对吧？ 所以我们是否可能 不带观点看法地去思考？ 请跟着我一起来探究它， 我将会慢慢地来深入它。 我们是否可能不带任何结论地去观察？ 我们是否可能纯粹地、 没有任何曲解地去聆听？ 所以我们将会慢慢地、 一步一步地来深入探究它。 |
| 37:46 It's a nice evening, it's nice to sit under the trees and talk about serious things, not to forget to look at the leaves, the branches and the blue sky that is beyond, and to see the sunset and the beauty of the colour, the clouds with their light on it, and also to see ourselves exactly as we are. You can't change the clouds, you can't change the sunset. So, to look at yourself without the desire to change. Because the very desire to change is born out of a motive either of greed, or to better oneself in order to reach some principle, some ideal. So, can you observe yourself without a single movement of thought? You understand my question? | 37:46 这是一个美好的夜晚， 坐在树下感觉很棒， 然后谈论一些严肃的话题， 但不要忘记去观察一下那些树叶、 那些树枝和远方的蓝天， 去观察日落， 那种美丽的色彩， 透着光亮的云朵， 同样的，我们也要如实地去观察我们自己。 你是无法去改变那些云朵的， 你也无法去改变日落。 所以，请你去观察自己， 而没有任何「想要改变」的欲望。 因为「想要改变的欲望」本身， 它是源自于某种动机的 ——这种动机要么是出于贪婪， 要么是想要让自己“变得更好”， 从而去达到某种行为/道德准则、某个理想。 所以，你能否观察自己， 而没有丝毫思想的活动呢？ 你们理解我的问题吗？ |
| 39:24 So, first let's find out what it means to listen. Don't say, 'I have heard that before from you.' There are many people here who unfortunately come year after year without changing. It becomes a game. They are not serious. But even though they have been here very often and heard the speaker, please forget what he has said previously, totally forget all that he has said, and begin again. You know, when you look at a flower day after day, the flower is never the same, is it? 40:34 The beauty of the flower varies from day to day. In the same way those of you who have listened to the speaker for many, many, many years listen to it as though you were listening to it for the first time. Then you are learning, not memorising, but you are learning about yourself. Without learning about yourself you have no basis for a correct action, for right response, for objective comprehension. | 39:24 所以首先，让我们去搞清楚： 「聆听」究竟是什么意思。 不要说，“我之前已经听你讲过这个了。 ” 这里有很多人， 他们年复一年地过来听我演讲， 但遗憾的是，他们仍旧没有改变。 这变成了一场游戏。 他们还不够认真。 但尽管如此，他们还是会经常在这里 聆听演讲者的话语， 所以请忘掉他（演讲者）以前说过的东西， 完全忘记他曾经说过的一切，然后重新开始。 你瞧，当你看着一朵鲜花时， 日复一日地去看它， 你会发现这朵花永远不会是相同的， 是这样的吧？ 40:34 这朵花的美每天都会有所变化。 同样的道理，你们中那些一直在听演讲者， 听了很多很多年的人， 请聆听我的演讲 ——就好像你是第一次听到它一样。 这样的话，你就是在学习， 你并不是在记忆， 而是在学习了解你自己。 不去学习了解你自己， 你就丧失了正确的行动、 正确的反应 和客观了解的基础。 |
| 41:32 So, first we are going to find out together. I am not telling you what to do, but together we are going to find out what it means to listen. Do we ever listen to anybody? Are you listening to what I am saying now? Are you? If you are honest, are you listening? Or your mind is so occupied with other things. Or you are here because the speaker has a reputation, and you are searching what he is going to say. So, all these movements prevent actual listening. Right? Because it is very important to learn the art of listening. Because if you learn that art, not memorise it, because if you merely memorise how to listen then you are not listening. 43:08 So what does it mean to listen, not only to the world outside of you, but also to listen to one's own deep mutterings, deep anxieties, fears. What does it mean to listen? There is a listening with the ear, with the ear, and also there is a listening without the operation of the nervous reactions. Do you follow what I am saying? Are we somewhat together in this? Am I speaking Greek, or Chinese, or are we understanding each other? Because it is very important to find out what it means to listen, to observe. Because we are going to... to observe without any distortion the actual movement of ourselves. 44:37 And so to observe, to listen is a great art. And we are learning that art together. I am not your teacher. And I really mean it. I am not your authority. But as two friends talking over together their problems, their fears, their anxieties, and each friend talks about his own problems, and together they approach, they resolve the problems. So we are doing the same. Not that the speaker has resolved - he has - but we are trying to communicate, so we are sharing together. | 41:32 所以，首先，我们将要一起去发现。 我并没有在告诉你该怎么做， 而是我们将要一起去发现 “聆听意味着什么”。 我们可曾聆听过任何人？ 你现在正在聆听我的话语吗？ 你在听吗？ 如果你是诚实的， 请问你在聆听吗？ 还是说，你的头脑充满了其他的东西。 或者说，你之所以来这里， 是因为演讲者很有名气， 所以你过来看看他会说些什么。 因此，所有这些活动都阻碍了真正的聆听。 对吧？ 因为学会「聆听的艺术」是非常重要的。 如果你学会了这种艺术， 不是去记住它， 因为如果你仅仅是记住了 “如何去聆听”， 那么你就没有在聆听。 43:08 所以「聆听」到底是什么意思， 不只是聆听在你之外的世界， 同样也要聆听 你自己内心深处的喃喃自语、 内心深处的各种焦虑和恐惧。 「聆听」意味着什么呢？ 我们会用耳朵去听， 用我们的耳朵，同样还有着一种 没有神经反应活动的聆听。 你们跟上我所说的东西了吗？ 我们对于这一点 是否多少都有些理解了？ 我难道是在说什么 希腊语或者中国话吗？ 还是说，我们正在互相理解对方？ 因为这一点是很重要的： 那就是要去发现 「聆听」和「观察」意味着什么。 因为我们即将要去 毫无扭曲地观察 我们自身实际的活动。 44:37 所以，观察和聆听，是一种伟大的艺术。 而我们正在一起学习这种艺术。 我并不是你们的老师。 我是说真的。 我也不是你们的权威。 我们就像是两个朋友， 正在一起讨论 他们的问题、他们的恐惧、他们的焦虑， 每一个朋友都会谈论 他自己的各种问题， 然后他们会一起去处理、 去解决这些问题。 所以我们也在做着同样的事情。 不是说演讲者已经解决了（他的问题） ——虽然他的确已经解决了—— 而是我们正试着去彼此交流， 由此我们便是在一起分享。 |
| 45:48 So first, what does it mean to listen? To listen to a statement, to listen to the noise of that crow, to listen to that honking of that car, to listen to your own thought, to your own feelings. And to listen implies no interference of thought. Because the moment thought intervenes by saying, 'It is good or bad, I don't like that noise, I do like that noise,' you are not listening. Right? Please do it now as you are there and I am explaining it, do it now, not when you go home, then it is too late, then you haven't heard. | 45:48 所以首先，我们要问： 「聆听」是什么意思？ 聆听一段陈述， 聆听那只乌鸦发出的嘈杂声， 聆听那辆汽车发出的喇叭声， 也包括聆听你自己的想法念头、 你自己的各种感受。 而聆听意味着 没有思想的干扰。 因为一旦思想介入进来，说， “它是好的或坏的，我不喜欢那个噪音， 或者我很喜欢那个噪音”， 那么你就并没有在「聆听」。 对吧？ 请你们现在就这么去做， 既然你们都在这里， 而我正在解释它： 请你们现在就这样去做。 而不是在你回家以后， 那就太迟了， 那样的话，你就没有在聆听。 |
| 47:16 So, the speaker is going to make many, many statements, and you have to find out for yourself whether they are true or false. But if you listen with what you have learnt from books, from authority, from this or from your experience, then you are blocking yourself from actually listening to what the other person has to say. Do you understand the responsibility on your part: to listen to the world and to your own anxiety, insecurity, uncertainty, sorrow? We will go into it, step by step into the whole of fear, sorrow, pain, anxiety, the whole of human existence, we will go into it. But first we must learn how to listen to all this. | 47:16 所以，演讲者将会做出很多很多的陈述， 而你必须要自己去发现 它们究竟是对是错。 但如果你的聆听是带着那些 你从书本中学到的知识， 你从权威、从这里 或者从自己经验中学到的东西， 那么你就阻止了你自己 去真正地聆听 别人要说的东西了。 你明白你自己这一方的责任了吗： 你要去聆听这个世界， 聆听你自己的焦虑、 不安全感、不确定感和痛苦。 我们将会一步一步地来深入探究关于恐惧、 悲伤、痛苦、焦虑的全部内容， 探究人类的整个存在，我们将会来探究它。 但首先，我们必须学会如何去聆听所有这一切。 |
| 48:42 Then comes also how to observe, what it means to observe. You are observing me, the speaker, how do you observe me? Examine that very simple fact: you are sitting there, the speaker is here, you are watching, you are seeing him. Are you actually seeing him, or you have images about him, conclusions, ideas? So, conclusions, reputation, image prevent you from actually looking at the person. Right? Do you understand this very simple fact? If you say, 'He is a socialist,' you don't look at him. If you say, 'Oh, he is communist,' the label prevents you from observing him. Then if you say, 'He is a Muslim,' it is finished, for a Hindu. | 48:42 然后我们也要探究一下“如何观察？”， 以及“观察意味着什么？”。 你们正在观察着我，观察着这个演讲者， 那么你是怎么观察我的？ 来检视一下这个非常简单的事实： 你坐在那里， 而演讲者坐在这里，你正在观察， 你正在看着演讲者。 那么你是真的在看他吗？ 还是说，你有着关于他的各种「印象」、 各种你的结论和看法？ 所以，各种结论、他的名声、 以及印象，它们阻碍了你去切实地观察那个人。 对吧？ 你是否明白了这个非常简单的事实？ 如果你说，“他是一个社会主义者”， 那你就没有在看他。 如果你说，“噢，他只是一个共产主义者”， 那么这个（共产主义者的）标签 就阻碍了你对于他的观察。 或者，如果你说，“他是一个穆斯林”， 那么对于印度教徒而言，观察就结束了。 |
| 50:09 So, can you observe - please listen - can you observe without a single movement of your prejudice? That prejudice is put together by thought. If I want to know you I must forget all my labels, whether I like you or not, this or that, and just look at you. By observing I learn. That's the beginning of wisdom, to observe, not from books. That's one thing. Listening, observing, and learning. | 50:09 所以，你是否能够这样去观察 ——请听好了—— 你能否去观察 而没有丝毫偏见的活动？ 那种偏见是由思想所拼凑起来的。 但如果我想要了解你， 我就必须忘掉所有我给你贴的“标签”， 不管是“我喜欢你”还是“不喜欢你”， 这个标签或那个标签，我只是看着你。 我在通过观察而学习。 而这就是「智慧」的开始： 即 不是通过书本去观察。 这是一件事。 聆听、观察并学习。 |
| 51:11 What does it mean to learn? From the age of five or six we go to school. There we learn facts. We learn a great deal of information and store it up in the brain as memory. Right? Right, sirs? Memory stored up, and with that memory we act: to have a career, a job, money, and so on; we accumulate knowledge both biological, physics, mathematics, and so on, and gather all that information from past researches, from all the people who have gathered information, and they have handed it down to us, from generation to generation, and that is stored up in the brain. 52:32 And that's what we call learning. Learning, gathering information, gathering what other people have said, about god, about heaven, about how you should live, or should not live, what is right, and so on. Gathered all that, and stored up in our brains. And that's called knowledge. That's one way of learning. Right? | 51:11 而「学习」又意味着什么呢？ 我们从五六岁的时候开始去上学。 我们在学校里学习各种「事实知识」。 我们学习掌握了大量的信息， 然后将信息储存在大脑里， 将其变为「记忆」。 对吧？ 是这样吧，先生们？ 「记忆」被储存起来， 然后我们带着这种记忆去行动： 去开创自己的事业， 拥有一份工作、赚钱，等等； 我们积累了各种知识：生物学的知识、 物理学知识、数学知识，等等， 然后把所有过去各种研究所得到的信息 聚集起来， 从所有那些已经积聚了信息的人那里收集信息， 而这些人将这些信息传递给了我们， 一代又一代地传下来， 这些信息被储存在大脑中。 52:32 而这就是我们所谓的“学习”。 学习、收集积累信息， 收集积累那些别人说过的东西 ——关于「神」的、关于「天国」的， 关于“你应该怎样生活”或者“不应该怎样生活”， 什么才是正确的，等等。 收集积累所有这些东西， 然后将其储存在我们的大脑里。 而它们被称之为“知识”。 这是一种学习的方式。 是吧？ |
| 53:14 There is also another way of learning: to go out and act, and from that action learn, which becomes knowledge. So, we are always acting from knowledge, and knowledge is always the past, that which has been. Right? That's what is called learning. Learning from other people's experience, from your own experience, from the habits, the customs, tradition handed down from generation to generation, it's stored up in the brain. Our brains are very, very, very old. And that is generally called learning. So we are acting with knowledge, which is the past. Right? Please see this, because we are going to investigate into what is learning. | 53:14 还有另一种学习的方式： 走出去然后行动起来，从行动中学习， 而这种行动的经验也会变成“知识”。 所以我们总是在通过「知识」而行动， 而「知识」永远都是「过去」，它总是以前的东西。 对吧？ 这就是所谓的“学习”。 从别人的经验中学习， 从你自己的经验中学习， 从那些一代代传下来的 习惯、风俗和传统中学习， 这些知识被储存在大脑中。 所以我们的大脑是非常非常古老的。 这就是通常人们所说的“学习”。 因此我们是带着知识在行动 ——而知识就是「过去」。 对吧？ 请看到这一点。 因为我们将会来探讨“什么是「学习」”。 |
| 54:31 There is another way of learning which is not the accumulation of knowledge, which I am going to explain presently. But first we must understand very clearly: where knowledge is absolutely essential - to drive a car, to do anything, to speak a language, to know where your house is. So, knowledge is essential. But knowledge is always in the past. So, we are living in the past. Right? | 54:31 但还有另一种学习的方式， 这种学习并不是“知识的积累” ——我马上就会来解释它。 但首先，我们必须非常清楚地明白： 在什么领域 知识是绝对必要的 ——比如驾驶汽车， 去做某些事情，去说一门语言， 知道你的家住在哪里。 所以知识是必不可少的东西。 但知识永远都是属于「过去」的。 因此我们是活在「过去」中的。 对吧？ |
| 55:22 And there is another way of learning which is not the accumulation of knowledge. Will you kindly listen to what I have to say? Listen, don't agree or disagree, don't accept or deny, just listen as you would listen to that bird. As I said, as the speaker said just now, we only know one method of learning, which is to accumulate knowledge. And from that knowledge operate, function, to have a job, to have a house, and so on, so on, so on. That knowledge becomes dangerous in relationship. Do you understand? If knowledge, which is remembrance, becomes important in human relationship with each other, that very knowledge divides people. We will go into it. Just listen to it. | 55:22 然后还存在着另一种学习的方式， 它并不是知识的积累。 你们可以好好地聆听一下 我要说的东西吗？ 聆听，不要去同意或者不同意， 不要去接受或者否定， 只是去聆听 ——就像你聆听那只鸟儿一样。 就如我所说的，就像演讲者刚才所说的， 我们只知道一种学习的方法 ——那就是「积累知识」。 然后我们通过那种知识来运转、运作， 去找一份工作，去拥有一幢房子， 等等，等等。 然而在关系中， 那种「知识」就会变得很危险。 你理解了吗？ 知识就是「记忆」，如果知识 在人类彼此间的关系中变得重要， 那么这种知识本身就会分裂人类。 我们将会来探讨它。请听好了。 |
| 57:11 We are saying there is another way of learning. Shall I go on? That implies... I am not trying to be clever, making you impatient, but I want to communicate it, so that you really understand it, that you understand it not only with your brain, but also intellectually, and also with your heart. You understand? With your mind, with your brain, the quality of the brain that listens, and the intellectual capacity to reason logically, sanely, and also to have this quality of affection, care, love, because those are demanded when you want to discover something new. 58:57 You understand? When you want to find out something totally new there must be complete harmony, not just intellect operating on its own, or the brain remembering all the past incidents, happenings, conclusions, and holding on to them, and also to have... - perhaps which is the most difficult thing - to have care, love, affection. | 57:11 我们在说：存在着另一种学习的方式。 要我继续讲下去吗？ 它（这种学习方式）意味着 我不是要故作聪明， 让你们变得心急， 我只是想要和你们交流它， 由此你们就可以真正地理解它， 你并不只是用你的大脑理解了它， 在思想智力上理解了它， 同样也用你的心灵理解了它。 你们明白了吗？ 用你的头脑、用你的大脑， 那种能够去聆听的大脑所具有的品质， 以及那种能够逻辑地、理智地去推理思辨的智力能力， 同样也要拥有那种 情感、关心和爱的品质， 因为当你想要发现某些新的事物， 上述这些品质是必需的。 58:57 你理解了吗？ 当你想要去发现 某些完全崭新的东西时， 你必须要有「完全的和谐」， 不仅仅只有思想智力独自运作， 或者大脑记住了所有过去的 事件、意外和结论， 然后紧抓着它们不放， 同样地，我们也要有 ——或许这才是最困难的事情—— 我们也要有关心、爱、以及情感。 |
| 59:37 So, we are going to find out together if there is a different way of living, which is learning and acting. Just see the difference between what I am going to say, and what we generally do: we accumulate knowledge, and from that knowledge act. There is a time interval - please listen - there is a time interval between the idea and the action. Right? You are following all this? That is, there is the ideal, and you are trying to put that ideal into action, so there is a gap between the principle, the ideal, the belief, and the actuality. Right? Now, we are saying the interval of time between the ideal and action is non-existent. It is going to be a little difficult, please give your attention if you are interested in it. If you are not, carry on in your own way. | 59:37 所以，我们将要一起来发现 是否存在着一种不同的生活方式 ——这种生活方式就是「学习并行动」。 请看到这两者的区别 ——即我将要说的东西 和我们通常所做的事情的区别： 我们通常会积累知识， 然后通过那种知识来行动。 存在着一种时间上的「间隔」 ——请听好了—— 在「想法」和「行动」之间 有一个时间上的间隔。 对吧？ 你们理解所有这一切了吗？ 换句话说，存在着某个理想， 然后你试图将那个理想付诸于行动， 所以在行为/道德准则、 理想、信仰，和「真实现状」之间 存在着一道“鸿沟”。 对吧？ 而现在，我们在说： 这种“时间上的间隔”， 这种「理想」与「行动」之间的间隔， 它是不存在的。 这一点将会变得有点难懂， 请你们集中注意力 ——如果你们对此感兴趣的话。 如果你们不感兴趣， 你们可以继续走自己的老路。 |
| 1:01:12 Please see what we do actually. We conceive an idea, and try to put that idea into action. So there is a time interval, a gap between idea and action. This is clear. Right? Would you disagree with that? Now, we are saying there is a way of acting, there is a way of learning, in which there is no time interval and therefore the learning is acting; not acting from previous knowledge. I am going to explain it. Go slowly. First, I want to establish communication between us. | 1:01:12 请看到我们实际上在做的事情。 我们构想了一个“想法”， 然后努力将那个“想法”付诸于行动。 由此便有了一个时间上的“间隔”， 一道“想法”和行动之间的鸿沟。 这是很显然的事。 对吧？ 你们难道不同意这点吗？ 然而现在，我们说： 存在着一种行动方式， 存在着一种学习方式， 在其中是没有“时间上的间隔”的， 因此「学习」就是「行动」； 不是经由过去的知识来行动。 我将会来解释这一点。 让我们慢慢来。 首先，我想要建立起我们之间的交流。 |
| 1:02:21 A first-class engineer is very well acquainted with the piston engine, the internal combustion machinery. And he wants to discover something new. Naturally, the brain is full of what he has learnt, full of the knowledge of the combustion engine. Right? And if he wants to discover something totally new he must put that aside. He must have a mind that is free to observe, to listen, to grasp something that may be just there. So, the requirement for learning, which is not merely the accumulation of knowledge, is to have a mind that is not burdened with knowledge. 1:03:39 And all our brains are burdened with knowledge. Just see the fact! The more traditional you are, the more you have read, read the Gita, whatever you read, it is all stored up, it is registered in your brain, and so you can never find something totally new. I was once with a friend, a very well-known author, and we were talking, he was a friend of mine, and he said, 'You know, I have read so much, I have read all the Eastern philosophy, the Chinese, of course the European, I know all about communism, Marx I've read, and so on, and I have no space for the new.' 1:04:50 You understand? A mind that is traditional, like most minds are, something handed down from generation to generation - a custom, a habit, a ritual, a puja - you know, all that, how can such a mind find something new? Do you understand my question? | 1:02:21 一位一流的工程师， 他非常熟悉活塞发动机， 内燃的机制。 但他想要去发现某种全新的东西。 很自然地，他的大脑已经充满了 他所学过的东西， 充满了关于内燃机的知识。 对吧？ 而如果他想要去发现某种完全崭新的东西， 他就必须把这些东西放在一边。 他必须要有一个 能够自由地去观察、 去聆听的头脑，能够去领会某种 或许就在那里的东西 所以，对于「学习」来说，它所需要的 不只是「知识的积累」， 而是要去拥有一个 没有背负着知识重担的头脑。 1:03:39 而我们所有人的大脑都背负着知识的重担。 请看到这个事实！ 你越是传统，你就读得越多， 读《薄伽梵歌》，读任何东西， 这些东西全都储存在你的大脑中， 它被记录在你的大脑里， 因此，你永远无法发现 某种完全崭新的东西。 有一次我和一位朋友在一起， 他是一位非常著名的作家， 我们彼此交谈， 他是我的一位朋友，他对我说， “你瞧，我已经读了那么多的书， 我已经阅读了所有东方的哲学， 那些中国人的哲学， 当然也包括欧洲人的哲学， 我清楚关于共产主义理论的一切， 我读过马克思的东西，等等。 然后我变得没有空间 去容纳新的东西了。” 1:04:50 你们可以理解吗？ 一个传统的头脑 ——绝大多数头脑都是传统的—— 会拥有那些一代又一代传下来的东西： 风俗、习惯、仪式、印度教礼拜。 你们都知道所有这些东西， 所以这样的头脑 又怎么能够发现某些新的事物呢？ 你明白我的问题吗？ |
| 1:05:23 Therefore to find a way of learning, which is not accumulation of knowledge, the other must be put aside completely. That means no tradition. Are you willing to do that? No, sir. Tradition is very comforting; caught in a routine, like a machine you go on, and on, and on, and on. | 1:05:23 因此 要找到这种 并非「知识积累」的学习方式， 我们就必须将其他的东西完全抛弃。 这意味着不再有传统的东西。 你们愿意这样去做吗？ 不，你们不会。 因为「传统」令人非常舒服， 像机器一样陷入于某种常规惯例， 你就这样不停地运转着、运转着。 |
| 1:06:05 So, I am telling you something, which is, the mind, the brain must be completely free of prejudice, of opinion, of belief. of all the things thought has put together in the brain. You understand this? Now, is that possible? Are you following? A professor, a scientist, if he wants to discover something new, naturally, he can't keep on repeating his own knowledge. It is absolutely useless. He wants to discover, he wants to find something fresh, not put together by thought. 1:07:09 So, first to learn, which is not mere accumulation of knowledge, the mind must be free to observe. That is, the mind... though it has got tremendous knowledge, must be capable, have the subtlety, have the energy, to set it aside and be free, so that it has an insight, insight into what is actually going on. You understand my question? Do you follow? Am I explaining things clearly? If not please tell me, I'll go over it in different ways. | 1:06:05 所以我正在告诉你们一些东西， 也就是：心灵、大脑， 它必须变得彻底自由， 摆脱掉偏见、观点、信仰， 摆脱掉思想在大脑中组合起来的所有东西。 你们理解它了吗？ 那么，这可能吗？ 你们跟上了吗？ 一位教授、一位科学家， 如果他想要去发现某种新的事物， 很自然地，他就不能继续重复 他自己的知识。 这样做是完全没用的。 他想要去发现，他想要去找到某种 焕然一新的东西， 某种并非由思想拼凑起来的东西。 1:07:09 所以，首先我们要去「学习」， 这种「学习」并不仅仅是知识的积累， 头脑必须要能够自由地去观察。 换句话说，头脑 尽管它已经获得了无数的知识， 但它必须要有这种能力、 这种敏锐、这种能量， 能将知识放在一边，让自己变得自由， 由此它便会有一种洞察力， 能洞察到实际在发生的事情。 你们理解我的问题吗？ 你们跟上了吗？ 我是否把事情解释清楚了？ 如果没有解释清楚，请告诉我， 我会以不同的方式再来讲一遍。 |
| 1:08:19 We live in the past and therefore we are always destroying the present. The past modifies itself in the present and becomes the future, but it's still the past. Right? I wonder if you are following all this. Please. So, our life, our daily life is based on a routine, going to the office for the next 50 years - just think of it! And tradition, your sexual habits, your loneliness - all that is part of this enormous accumulation of knowledge. And from that knowledge, which is the past, we're acting. Now, the speaker is saying there is an action which is not of the past. That implies a mind, a brain that has put aside all remembrance. I'll show you, I'll go into it and you will capture the meaning of it. | 1:08:19 我们是活在「过去」中的， 因此我们总是在摧毁着「当下」。 「过去」在此刻修改了自身， 然后变成了「未来」， 但这个“未来”仍旧是「过去」。 对吧？ 我不知道你们是否跟上了这一切。 请跟上它。 所以，我们的生活，我们的日常生活， 它是基于「例行公事」的， 去办公室上班，一上就是五十年 ——想想这事儿吧！ 而传统、你性爱的习惯、你的孤独 ——所有这些都是这种「庞大知识积累」的一部分。 而我们通过这种「知识」来行动 ——知识就是「过去」。 而现在，演讲者在说的是： 存在着一种并非属于「过去」的行动。 这意味着头脑、大脑 已经抛开了所有的记忆。 我会向你们展示这一点，我会来深入讲解它， 这样你们便能领会到它的含义了。 |
| 1:10:10 No remembrance, and therefore it is capable of observing instantly and acting instantly. The very observation is the action. Not, 'I have learnt, and then act.' Therefore that implies a time interval. In that time interval all other factors enter. Therefore in that interval there is contradiction, there is pain, and so on, so on. Whereas what we are saying is, to have insight into the whole structure of my consciousness, of your consciousness. I am going to go into it. To have an insight into your whole consciousness, and that very insight is the action which dispels the content of consciousness, which makes up consciousness. I hope you understand all this. I doubt it! | 1:10:10 那时没有「记忆」了，由此它便能够 立即去观察，并且立即行动了。 这种观察本身就是「行动」。 不是“我学会了，然后再行动”。 那样的话就暗示了有一个“时间上的间隔”。 在那种时间的间隔中， 所有其他因素都会介入进来。 由此在那个“间隔”中，就会有矛盾冲突， 就会有痛苦，等等，等等。 然而，我们在说的是： 去洞察「我的意识」的整个结构， 洞察到你意识的整个结构。 我将会来深入探讨它。 洞察到你全部的意识， 这种洞察本身就是「行动」， 它消除掉了 意识的内容， 而正是「意识的内容」构成了意识。 我希望你们都理解了这一切。 但我对此持怀疑态度！ |
| 1:11:30 Look, sirs, what is action in your life, if you look at it? I am sorry to go back to it - I must till this is absolutely clear. It is based on memory, on knowledge, or a motive, based on some self-interest, and so on, so on. So, knowledge has its place. And in relationship with each other, has knowledge any place at all? It is very important to find out. Which means in relationship there is mere memory; is memory, remembrance love? When you say 'my wife' it is a remembrance. You have the image of her, or the husband, or the girl, you have an image of her. That remembrance is the outcome of past incidents, experiences, memory, and so in relationship where there is memory there cannot be love. Logically. | 1:11:30 你瞧，先生们， 如果你观察一下它的话， 你在生活中的行动是怎样的？ 我很抱歉又要返回去了 ——我必须这么做， 除非直到这一点完全清楚了为止。 你的行动是基于「记忆」、基于「知识」、 基于「动机」，或者基于某种「私利」等等的。 所以，「知识」有它自己的位置。 而在人与人彼此间的关系中， 知识在其中应该有任何位置吗？ 去搞清楚这一点是非常重要的。 因为这意味着在关系中仅仅只有「记忆」了； 然而记忆、回忆，它们是「爱」吗？ 当你说“我的妻子”，这就是一种「回忆」。 你有着关于她的意象，或者关于丈夫的意象， 或者关于女朋友的意象， 你会对她有一个印象。 而这种「回忆」， 它是过去事件、经验和记忆的产物， 所以在关系中，当有了「记忆」， 就不可能会有「爱」了。 这是合乎逻辑的。 |
| 1:13:12 So, we are saying, to have an insight is not a continuation of memory or remembrance. I am going to explain what that means. Our brain - I am not a specialist on the brain, I have watched it in oneself, you watch it, and if you watch you don't have to pick up a single book, you can see it all yourself. Our brains have the capacity to register, register an incident, an event, a happening, an insult, a flattery, a hurt, it has the capacity to register as a computer. As long as the computer is in operation there is no sense of freedom to observe. Please listen to this. 1:14:49 If the brain is registering, and therefore retaining it as memory and acting from that memory, then that action is born from the past. That's so. And so, between the action and the past there is an interval, therefore there is conflict, therefore there is adjustment and a sense of constant struggle to approximate. Now, can the brain - please listen to this, give 2 minutes concentration or attention - can the brain register only what's necessary and nothing else? What is necessary is your physical needs. What is necessary is to have knowledge to act in daily life: where you live, what language you speak, how to drive a car, how to design a house, and so on, or design a machine to kill other people - all that. 1:16:38 That is the function of the brain - to register. And we said, register only what is necessary. And psychologically don't register anything. Try it, do it! Because that is where the trouble begins. I am attached to you, psychologically, inwardly, because you give me money, you are my this or that, you give me satisfaction, comfort, sex and this or that, I am attached to you, psychologically. | 1:13:12 所以，我们在说的是： 拥有这种洞察，它并不是 记忆或回忆的延续。 我将会来解释一下这话的意思。 我们的大脑——我并不是什么大脑方面的专家， 但我观察过它， 观察过自己的大脑，你也可以观察它， 如果你能够去观察， 你就不需要再拿起任何一本书了， 你完全可以靠自己看清一切。 我们的大脑拥有那种去记录的能力， 去记录某个事件，某件大事， 某件事情，某次侮辱、 奉承或伤害， 它拥有像计算机那样去记录的能力。 而只要“计算机”还是在运作着， 你就无法拥有那种自由观察的感觉。 请你们听好了。 1:14:49 如果大脑在记录着， 并将它记录的东西保留下来作为「记忆」， 然后经由那种「记忆」来行动的话， 那么这种行动就是源自于「过去」的。 就是这样。 所以在「行动」和「过去」之间 存在着一个“间隔”， 由此便会有冲突， 由此便会有「调整」， 以及一种持续不断努力去接近模仿的感觉。 而现在，大脑是否能够 ——请认真听好， 花两分钟时间 保持专注或集中注意力—— 大脑是否能够只去记录必要的东西， 而不去记录其他东西？ 必要的东西是你生理物质上的需求。 必要的东西是你需要知识， 由此才能在日常生活中行动： 你住在哪里，你说的是什么语言， 如何驾驶汽车，如何设计一幢房子，等等， 或者设计一个用来杀人的机器 ——所有这些东西。 1:16:38 这就是大脑的职责——也就是去记录。 而我们说：只需去记录必要的东西。 但在心理上，则不要去记录任何东西。 去尝试一下它，去做它！ 因为麻烦困扰就是从这里开始的： 我执著于你 ——心理上、内心深处我执著于你， 因为你给了我钱， 你是我的某某某，你让我感到满足， 给我安慰、性爱，这个或那个， 于是我变得在心理上执著于你。 |
| 1:17:33 So, the attachment is totally unnecessary. Whereas the other is necessary. Do you follow all this? So, can you... can you see the importance of keeping knowledge in its right place and psychologically have no knowledge at all? You don't understand all this. There is a great deal of fun in all this if you go into it. So, your brain is capable of registering what is necessary and psychologically nothing. So the brain is free - you understand? - because it has settled what is necessary, not extravagantly necessary, what is necessary. And psychologically it has no content. You don't see the beauty of it. And so the brain then, being free, can perceive instantly and act - the very perception is action. | 1:17:33 因此，这种「执著」是毫无必要的。 然而在其他方面则是有必要的。 你们跟上所有这些了吗？ 所以，你是否可以 你能否看到这一点的重要性： 也就是 要把知识放在它正确的位置上， 而在心理上则没有任何知识？ 你们并不理解这一切。 如果你深入下去的话， 所有这些东西中有着无穷的乐趣。 所以，你的大脑能够去记录 那些必要的东西， 而在心理上则不去记录任何东西。 由此大脑就自由了 ——你理解了吗？ —— 因为它已经确定了那些必要的东西， 不是奢侈挥霍，而是那些必需的东西。 而在心理上，它却没有任何记录内容。 你们还没有看到这其中的「美」。 因此，那时的大脑因为获得了自由， 它便能够立即“看到” 并行动了——“看到”就是行动。 |
| 1:19:07 Now, I'll show you something. You probably belong to some kind of religious organisation. Your particular organisation is different from another particular religious organisation. Right? So there is conflict between the two, or you tolerate the two, or you adjust between the two. But there is always the two. And therefore there must inevitably be conflict. All religious organisations have this element. Now, to have an insight into it and never belong to any religious organisation. You understand what I am saying? So that the very insight dispels the illusion of belonging to something - a religious organisation. 1:20:24 That is insight. Which is to observe completely free, so that the whole nature of organisations is revealed to you, and is finished. You never again belong to any single religious organisation, or even perhaps politically - much more important nowadays, because you are dealing with man as a whole, it is a global problem, not the problem of India, or America, or Russia, it is a global problem, which is the human problem. | 1:19:07 现在，我要来告诉你们一些东西。 你或许属于某个宗教组织。 而你所在的宗教组织， 它不同于另一个宗教组织。 对吧？ 由此两个宗教组织之间便会有冲突， 或者你会容忍这两者， 或者你会在这两者之间进行调整适应。 但永远都会有“两个”。 所以不可避免地会有冲突。 所有的宗教组织都包含了这个要素。 现在，请你们也洞察到这一点， 从而永远不再让自己属于任何宗教组织。 你们理解我在说的东西吗？ 由此这种洞察本身就可以消除掉 那种“自己属于某个事物——某个宗教组织”的错觉。 1:20:24 这就是「洞察」。 也就是去完全自由地观察， 由此各种组织的全部本质 就会向你显现出来， 然后它就结束了。 你永远不会再去属于任何一个 宗教组织了， 或许甚至也包括政治组织 ——在如今，这更加重要， 因为那时你是把人类当成一个整体在加以处理， 这是一个全球性的问题， 而不是印度的问题、美国的问题， 或者俄罗斯的问题，这是一个全世界面临的问题， 它是人类的问题。 |
| 1:21:06 Now, if I have conveyed this to you, if the speaker has conveyed the reality of this insight, which cannot be - please be careful with it because it is not a continuous thing that you keep going, then it becomes memory, then it is gone, it is finished. You can't use it for personal use. You understand? To have an insight into your fear which we will go into in a few days, as we go along. To have an insight into pleasure, into death, so that you see the truth of it, not your belief, not your prejudice, not your conclusions, not your imaginary illusory projections, but the actual truth of something. So that is the way, the way of learning, which is from moment to moment. You understand? Love is that. | 1:21:06 现在，如果我已经把这个观点传达给你了， 如果演讲者已经将这份洞察的真相传达给你了， 那它就不会是 ——请你们小心注意这一点， 因为它并不是一件 你们可以持续不断去做的事， 那样的话它就变成了「记忆」， 那时它就完了，它就结束了。 你不能把它用于私人用途。 你明白了吗？ 去洞察你的恐惧 ——随着这一系列演讲的推进， 我们过几天就会谈到这个。 去洞察你的快感、洞察「死亡」， 由此你便能够看清它的真相， 不是你的信仰、不是你的偏见、 不是你的结论、 不是你想象出来的虚幻的投射物， 而是某个事物实际的真相。 所以这就是那条道路， 那种学习的方式， 它是一刻接着一刻的。 你们理解了吗？ 「爱」就是如此。 |
| 1:22:41 We have talked for an hour and 25 minutes. That's enough, isn't it? We will continue tomorrow afternoon at 5 o'clock. | 1:22:41 我们已经讲了有一个小时二十五分钟了。 讲到这里已经够了，不是吗？ 明天下午五点，我们再继续讲下去吧。 |
