Krishnamurti Subtitles

What you think, you are

New York - 18 April 1971

Public Talk 2

0:25 Krishnamurti:
We were considering yesterday
0:30 the importance of relationship,
0:41 and how we always
live in the past,
0:49 and to find out
if it is at all possible
0:55 to radically change
one's way of living.
1:04 And we are
going to examine together
1:10 the question of what is hidden
in the consciousness,
1:17 the deeper layers of the mind,
1:23 which is generally called
the unconscious.
1:28 Because we are concerned
1:35 with bringing about in ourselves
and so in society,
1:42 a radical revolution.
1:47 The physical revolution,
1:53 which one is advocating all over
the world at the present time,
2:02 doesn't bring about a fundamental
change in man.
2:12 And though it is necessary
that a corrupt society,
2:16 such as this and Europe
and in India and elsewhere,
2:22 there must be fundamental changes
in the very structure of society.
2:31 And if man remains corrupt himself,
2:37 his activity,
2:41 he will overcome
whatever the structure be,
2:46 however perfect it be,
2:48 therefore it is imperative,
2:51 absolutely essential
that he change.
3:01 And is this change to be brought
about through the process of time,
3:12 through gradual achievement,
3:16 through gradual change,
3:23 or does the change take place
only in the instant?
3:30 And that is what we are going
to examine together.
3:37 One sees that
there must be change in oneself.
3:44 The more sensitive,
3:46 the more alert
and intelligent one is,
3:52 one is aware that there must be
3:58 a deep, abiding, living change.
4:09 And the content of consciousness
is consciousness,
4:13 the two are not separate.
4:17 What is implanted,
4:20 what is in consciousness
makes up consciousness.
4:30 And to bring about a change
in consciousness,
4:35 both the obvious and the hidden,
4:40 does it depend on analysis,
4:53 does it depend on time,
4:57 does it depend on
environmental pressure,
5:05 or is the change to take place
5:09 totally independent
of any pressure,
5:16 of any strain, of any compulsion?
5:24 You know,
this is going to be rather difficult,
5:27 to go into this question
because it's quite complex,
5:32 and I hope both of us
5:37 will be able to share
what is being said.
5:53 I don't know quite where to begin
this whole business, do you?
6:10 You see, unless one goes into
this matter very seriously,
6:16 really taking trouble,
6:21 deep interest, with a passion,
6:24 I'm afraid one will not be able
to go very far.
6:32 Far in the sense not in time
or in space
6:36 but within oneself very deeply.
6:40 One needs a great deal of passion,
6:45 a great energy,
6:50 and most of us waste
our energies in conflict,
6:56 and when we are examining
this whole business of existence
7:04 you need energy.
7:08 And energy comes with
the possibility of change.
7:15 If there is no possibility
of change
7:18 then energy wastes away.
7:24 We think we cannot
possibly change,
7:28 we accept things as they are
7:35 and thereby become
rather dispirited, depressed,
7:41 and uncertain and confused.
7:46 It is possible to change radically,
7:51 and that is what we are
going to examine.
7:55 And if you will not follow exactly
what the speaker is saying,
8:01 but using his words and
using those words as a mirror
8:08 to observe yourself and enquire
8:17 with passion,
with interest, with vitality
8:21 and a great deal of energy,
8:24 then perhaps we can
come to a point
8:31 where it will be obvious
8:36 that without any kind of effort,
8:41 without any kind of motive,
8:45 the radical change takes place.
8:58 As we were saying yesterday,
9:02 there is not only the superficial
knowledge of ourselves,
9:07 but also there is the deep,
9:16 content of our consciousness.
9:21 And how is one to examine that?
9:25 How is one to expose
the whole content of it?
9:32 Is it to be done bit by bit,
slowly, gradually,
9:41 or is it to be exposed totally
9:52 and understood instantly,
9:56 and thereby the whole
analytical process comes to and end?
10:04 Now we're going to go into
this question of analysis.
10:15 To me, to the speaker,
10:19 analysis is the denial of action,
10:29 action being always in the present,
active present.
10:36 Action means not 'having done',
or 'will do', but doing.
10:44 Analysis prevents
that active action in the present,
10:53 because in analysis
there is involved time,
11:05 a gradual peeling off,
as it were, layer after layer,
11:13 and examining each layer,
11:18 analysing the content
of each layer.
11:25 And if the analysis is not perfect,
complete, true,
11:34 then that analysis,
being incomplete,
11:43 must leave a knowledge
11:50 which is not total.
11:54 And the next analysis springs
from that which is not complete.
12:02 Are we following all this?
12:06 Look, I examine myself,
analyse myself,
12:13 and if my analysis is not complete,
12:19 then what I have analysed
becomes the knowledge
12:25 with which I proceed to analyse
the next layer.
12:34 And so,
12:37 in that process each analysis
becomes incomplete
12:46 and leads to further conflict,
and so to inaction.
12:56 Shall I go on?
13:00 And in analysis
13:03 there is the analyser
and the analysed,
13:09 whether the analyser
is professional,
13:13 or yourself, the layman,
13:17 there is this duality,
13:22 the analyser analysing,
13:27 analysing something which he thinks
is different from himself.
13:38 And the analyser,
13:43 what is he?
13:45 He is the past,
13:47 he is the accumulated knowledge
of all the things he has analysed.
13:55 And with that knowledge,
which is the past,
14:00 he analyses the present.
14:05 So, in that process
there is conflict,
14:11 there is the struggle to conform
14:17 or to force that which he analyses.
14:27 And in analysis,
14:30 there is this whole process
of dreaming.
14:40 I don't know if you have gone
into all this yourself,
14:43 or probably you have read
other people's books,
14:48 which is most unfortunate,
14:53 because then you merely repeat
what other people have said,
14:57 however specialist, however
famous they are.
15:03 But if you don't
read all those books,
15:06 as the speaker doesn't
because they're rather boring,
15:11 then you have to
investigate yourself,
15:15 then it becomes
much more fascinating,
15:19 much more original,
much more direct and true.
15:30 In the process of analysis
15:37 there is this world of dreams,
15:44 and we accept dreams
as necessary,
15:48 because the professionals
have said,
15:50 you must dream,
otherwise you go mad,
15:54 and there is some truth in that.
16:01 And what are dreams?
16:05 Because all this
we are enquiring into,
16:09 because we are trying to find out
16:12 whether it is possible
to change radically.
16:20 When there is so much confusion,
so much misery,
16:24 such hatred in the world,
and brutality,
16:30 where there is no compassion,
16:35 one must, if one is at all serious,
enquire into all this.
16:44 And we are enquiring not merely
for intellectual entertainment
16:49 but actually trying to find out
16:57 if it is possible to change.
17:01 And when you see the possibility
of change, whatever we are,
17:10 however shallow,
however superficial,
17:14 repetitive, imitative,
17:19 if we see that there is a possibility
of radical change
17:23 then we have the energy to change.
17:27 And if we say it is not possible,
then that energy is dissipated.
17:34 So we are enquiring
into this question,
17:43 whether analysis does produce
a radical change at all,
17:49 or is it merely
an intellectual entertainment,
17:56 an avoidance of action?
18:03 As we were saying,
18:06 analysis implies entering
into the world of dreams.
18:20 And what are dreams?
18:23 How do these dreams
come into being?
18:35 I don't know if you have
gone into this.
18:43 If you have, you will see
18:47 that dreams are the continuation
of our daily life.
18:57 What you are doing during the day,
19:01 all the mischief, the corruption,
19:07 the hatred, the passing pleasures,
19:12 the ambitions,
the guilt and so on,
19:18 all that is continued
19:27 in the world of dreams,
19:30 only as in symbols,
19:36 as pictures and images.
19:44 And these pictures and images
have to be interpreted,
19:49 and all the fuss and the unreality
of all that comes into being.
19:58 One never asks why should one
dream at all.
20:05 One has accepted dreams
as essential, as part of life.
20:13 Now we are asking ourselves,
if you are, with me,
20:18 why you dream at all?
20:23 Is it possible
when you go to sleep
20:26 to have a mind
that is completely quiet?
20:37 Because it's only in that
quiet state that it renews itself,
20:44 it empties itself of all
its content
20:49 so that it is made fresh, young,
20:53 decisive, not confused.
21:03 And if dreams are the continuation
of our daily life,
21:09 of our daily turmoil, anxiety,
21:15 the desire for security,
21:19 the attachments,
21:22 then inevitably,
21:26 dreams in their symbolic form
21:31 must take place.
21:36 That's clear, isn't it?
21:42 So, when one asks
21:46 why should one dream at all,
21:50 can the brain cells be quiet,
21:56 not carry on all the business
of the day.
22:07 To find that out,
22:10 experimentally,
22:14 not accepting what the speaker says
22:17 and for goodness sake
don't ever do that, please,
22:21 because we're sharing together,
investigating together.
22:28 To find out experimentally,
22:32 you can test it out
22:38 by being aware totally
during the day,
22:45 watching your thoughts,
22:48 your motives,
22:52 your speech,
22:55 the way you walk and talk.
22:59 When you are so aware,
23:04 there are the intimations of the
unconscious, of the deeper layers,
23:13 because then you are exposing,
23:18 inviting the hidden motives,
23:25 anxieties, all that,
23:27 the content of the unconscious
into the open.
23:33 So when you do go to sleep,
23:38 then you will find
23:40 that your mind,
including the brain,
23:47 is extraordinarily quiet,
it is really resting
23:54 because you have finished what you
have been doing during the day.
24:01 That is, I don't know
if you have ever done it,
24:06 if you take stock of the day
24:12 as you go to bed, lie down.
24:15 Don't you do this, go over the day,
taking stock?
24:20 Saying, I should have done this,
I should not have done that,
24:27 it was better said that way,
I wish I hadn't said this.
24:35 That is,
24:37 when you take stock of the things
that have happened during the day,
24:44 you are trying to put order,
24:49 please do pay a little
attention to this,
24:53 you are trying to bring about
order before you go to sleep.
24:59 And if you don't put order
before you go to sleep,
25:03 the brain tries to put order
25:09 when you are asleep.
25:11 Because the brain functions
perfectly only in order,
25:18 not in disorder.
25:26 It functions most efficiently
25:30 when there is complete order,
25:37 whether that order is neurotic
or rational.
25:46 You are following all this?
25:51 Because in neurosis, in imbalance,
25:55 there is order,
26:00 and the brain accepts that order.
26:10 And if you
26:16 take stock of everything that
has been happening during the day,
26:21 before you go to sleep,
26:25 then you are trying to
bring about order,
26:30 and therefore the brain hasn't to
bring order while you are asleep,
26:37 you have done it during the day.
26:41 And if you bring that order
every minute during the day,
26:46 that is,
26:48 if you are aware of everything
that is happening,
26:52 outwardly and inwardly.
26:54 You are following?
26:57 Outwardly in the sense,
the disorder about you,
27:01 the cruelty, the indifference,
the callousness,
27:07 the dirt,
the squalor, the quarrels,
27:10 the politicians
and their chicanery,
27:12 you know, all that is happening.
27:17 And your relationship
with your husband, wife,
27:20 with your girl or boy,
27:22 aware of all that during the day,
27:26 without correcting it,
just being aware of it.
27:31 The moment you try to correct it,
you are trying to bring disorder,
27:36 but if you merely observe
actually what is,
27:43 then what is, is order.
27:52 It is only when you try to change
what is, then there is disorder,
27:57 because you want to change
according to the knowledge
28:01 which you have acquired.
28:06 That knowledge is the past
28:11 and you are trying to change
what is, which is not the past,
28:15 according to what you have learnt.
28:21 Therefore there is a contradiction,
therefore there is a distortion,
28:25 therefore there is disorder.
28:31 I hope you are working as hard
as the speaker is.
28:40 May I take my coat off?
29:02 So, during the day,
if you are aware
29:13 of the ways of your thought,
29:17 your motives,
29:23 the hypocrisy, the double talk,
29:28 doing one thing,
saying another, thinking another,
29:35 the deception,
the masks that you put on,
29:43 the varieties of deceptions
29:48 that one has so readily at hand,
29:53 if one is aware of all that
during the day,
29:57 you don't have to take stock
at all when you go to sleep,
30:02 you are bringing order
each minute.
30:06 So when you do go to sleep
30:09 you will find that
your brain cells,
30:16 which have recorded
and which hold the past
30:26 become totally quiet,
30:30 and your sleep then
30:36 becomes something
entirely different.
30:41 In that sleep,
30:44 the mind, when we use
the word the mind,
30:49 we are including in that
the brain,
30:52 the whole nervous organism,
30:58 the affections,
31:00 all the human structure
is the mind.
31:07 When we use that word,
we mean all that,
31:10 not something separate.
31:13 In that is included the intellect,
the heart,
31:18 the whole nervous organism.
31:24 When you go to sleep then,
31:29 the analytical process
has totally come to an end.
31:36 Then when you wake up
31:38 you see things
exactly as they are,
31:45 not your interpretation of them
or the desire to change them.
31:59 So analysis, to the speaker,
32:05 prevents action.
32:11 And action is
absolutely essential,
32:15 now,
32:17 in order to bring about
this radical change.
32:23 So analysis is not the way.
32:30 Don't accept, please,
what the speaker is saying,
32:34 but observe it for yourself,
32:38 learn about it,
32:40 not from me,
but learn by watching
32:47 all the implications of analysis:
32:51 time,
32:54 the analyser and the analysed,
32:58 the analyser is the analysed
33:08 and each analysis must be complete
33:11 otherwise it distorts
the next analysis.
33:17 So seeing the whole process
of analysis,
33:21 whether it is introspective
or intellectual analysis,
33:26 is totally wrong.
33:35 It is not the way out.
33:38 It maybe necessary for those who
are somewhat or greatly unbalanced,
33:45 and perhaps most of us
are unbalanced.
33:52 So, that's not the way out.
33:56 So we must find a way
34:01 of observing
34:05 the whole content of consciousness
34:09 without the analyser.
34:12 You are following this?
34:16 You know, this is great fun
if you go into this,
34:23 because you have then
rejected totally
34:26 everything that man has said.
34:33 No, please, don't laugh.
34:36 Because then you stand alone,
34:41 then you find out for yourself.
34:44 It will be authentic, real, true,
34:48 not dependent on any professor,
any psychologist, any analyst,
34:55 and so on, so on.
35:01 So one must find a way of observing
without analysis.
35:13 I'm going to go into that.
35:19 I hope you don't mind
my doing all this, do you?
35:22 Audience: No.
35:24 K: This is not a group therapy.
35:34 This is not an open confessional.
35:39 This is not that the speaker is
analysing you or making you change
35:44 or you becoming marvellous
human beings,
35:47 you have to do this yourself.
35:52 And as most of us are second-hand
or third-hand human beings,
35:57 it is going to be very difficult
36:00 to put away totally
36:04 all that has been imposed on
our minds by the professionals,
36:08 whether religious professionals
or the scientific professionals.
36:14 We have to find out for ourselves.
36:22 And if analysis is not the way,
36:26 and it is not, as far as the
speaker is concerned,
36:30 because he has logically
explained it,
36:37 then how is one
36:41 to examine or to observe
36:45 the total content of consciousness?
36:52 And what is the total content?
36:57 What is the content
of consciousness?
37:00 Please don't repeat what
somebody else has said.
37:09 What is your total content?
37:17 Have you ever looked at it,
have you ever considered it?
37:25 If you have, is it not
37:35 the various recorded incidents,
37:43 happenings,
37:45 pleasurable and non-pleasurable,
37:50 various beliefs,
37:55 traditions,
38:00 the various individual
38:05 recollections, memories,
38:09 and the racial, family memories,
38:18 the culture in which one
has been brought up,
38:22 all that is the content, isn't it?
38:29 Being born in India as a Hindu,
38:34 Brahmin and so on,
38:38 with all its traditions
and superstitions,
38:44 with its dogmatism, beliefs,
38:49 all that culture of thousands
of years is stored up.
38:59 And the incidents
39:03 that take place every day,
the memories,
39:08 the various pains,
39:13 the unhappiness, the incidents,
the insults,
39:22 all that is recorded.
39:27 And the content of all that
is my consciousness,
39:32 as your consciousness.
39:34 You as a Catholic, Protestant,
living in this Western world
39:42 with the search for more
and more and more,
39:53 the world of great pleasure,
39:58 entertainment,
40:01 wealth,
40:05 incessant noise of the television,
40:12 the pictures, the brutality,
40:14 all that is you,
that's your content.
40:25 How is all that to be exposed,
40:31 and in the exposing of it,
40:36 is each incident to be examined,
40:42 each happening, each tradition,
40:45 each hurt, each pain,
40:49 one by one,
or is it to be looked at totally?
40:58 You are following all this?
41:02 If it is to be examined bit by bit,
one by one,
41:07 you are entering into
the world of analysis,
41:14 and then there is no end to that,
you will die analysing,
41:22 and giving a great deal of money
to those who analyse,
41:26 if that's your pleasure.
41:30 Or is it to be looked at totally?
41:40 We're going to find out how to look
at these various fragments,
41:47 which are the contents
of consciousness,
41:51 totally, not analytically.
42:01 We are communicating
with each other?
42:03 A: Yes.
42:08 K: So we are going to find out
how to observe
42:19 in which there is no analysis
at all.
42:26 That is, we have looked at everything,
at the tree, at the cloud,
42:33 at your wife and your husband,
the girl or the boy,
42:37 everything as an observer
and the observed.
42:45 Right?
42:50 Please do give a little attention
to this.
42:57 You have observed your anger,
43:00 your greed or your jealousy,
whatever it is,
43:06 as an observer looking at greed.
43:12 The observer is greed,
43:16 but you have separated
the observer
43:19 because your mind is conditioned
to the analytical process,
43:27 therefore you are always looking
at the tree, at the cloud,
43:33 at everything in life as an observer
and the thing observed.
43:41 Have you noticed it?
43:44 You look at your wife
43:47 through the image
which you have of her.
43:50 That image is the observer,
43:54 that image is the past,
44:00 that image has been put together
through time.
44:07 And the observer is the time,
44:12 is the past,
44:14 is the accumulated knowledge
of the various incidents and accidents
44:20 and happenings,
experiences and so on,
44:24 that observer is the past,
44:28 and he looks at the thing observed
44:33 as though he was not of it,
but separate from it.
44:42 Now, can you look
without the observer?
44:52 That is, can you look at the tree
44:57 - please listen to this -
44:59 can you look at the tree
without the past as the observer?
45:16 That is, when there is the observer
45:21 then there is space between
the observer and the observed,
45:27 the tree.
45:30 That space is time,
45:34 because there is a distance.
45:38 That time is the quality
of the observer,
45:44 who is the past,
45:49 who is the accumulated knowledge,
45:53 who says, that is the tree,
45:57 or that is the image of my wife.
46:03 Now, can you observe
without the observer?
46:10 That is, can you look,
46:14 not only at the tree
but your wife or your husband,
46:18 without the image?
46:26 This requires tremendous discipline.
46:34 I am going to show you something,
which is,
46:37 discipline implies generally
46:41 a conformity,
46:45 a drill,
46:49 imitation,
46:53 conflict
46:56 between what is
and what should be.
47:02 And so in discipline
there is conflict:
47:07 suppressing, overcoming,
the exercise of will and so on,
47:13 all that is implied in that word.
47:16 But that word means to learn,
47:24 not to conform,
47:28 not to suppress,
47:34 but to learn.
47:41 And the quality of the mind
that learns
47:43 has its own order,
which is discipline.
47:51 We are learning now to observe
without the observer,
47:58 without the past,
without the image.
48:03 When you so observe the 'what is,'
48:11 the actually what is,
is a living thing,
48:16 not a thing looked upon
as a dead thing,
48:23 as recognisable by the past event,
48:26 by the past knowledge.
48:33 Let's make it much simpler
than this.
48:44 You say something to me
which hurts me
48:55 and that hurt,
the pain of that hurt is recorded.
49:09 That memory of that continues
49:18 and when there is a further pain
49:21 it is recorded again.
49:27 So, the hurt is being strengthened
from childhood on.
49:36 Whereas when there is pain,
49:41 you say something
which is painful to me,
49:43 to observe it so completely
that it is not recorded as a hurt.
49:52 You are following?
49:55 The moment you record it as a hurt,
50:01 that recording is continued,
50:07 and for the rest of your life
you are being hurt,
50:12 because you are adding
to that hurt.
50:15 Whereas if you observe the pain,
50:23 and to observe the pain so completely
without recording it,
50:30 is to give your total attention
at the moment of the pain.
50:40 Are you doing all this?
50:50 Look, when you go out for a walk,
50:54 when you walk in these streets
there is all kinds of noise,
50:59 all kinds of shouting,
51:02 the vulgarity, the brutality,
51:05 this pouring in the noise,
that is very destructive.
51:12 The more sensitive you are
the more destructive it becomes,
51:18 it hurts your organism.
51:23 And you resist the hurt
51:31 and therefore you build a wall.
51:35 And when you build a wall
you are isolating yourself,
51:40 and therefore you are strengthening
the isolation,
51:43 which you will get
more and more hurt,
51:48 whereas if you are
observing that noise,
51:55 being attentive to that noise,
52:01 then you will see
that your organism is never hurt.
52:12 Please, if you understand
this one radical principle
52:20 you will have understood
something immense,
52:25 that where there is an observer
52:31 separating himself
from the thing he observes,
52:36 there must be conflict.
52:44 Do what you will,
as long as there is a division
52:48 between the observer and the observed
there must be conflict.
52:53 As long as there is division.
52:56 As long as there is a division between
the Muslim and the Hindu
53:00 there must be conflict.
53:02 As long as there is a division between
the Catholic and the Protestant
53:05 there must be conflict.
53:08 You may tolerate each other,
53:11 which is an intellectual covering
of intolerance.
53:18 As long as there is division between
the black and the white
53:22 and the purple and the blue
and the yellow and the black,
53:25 there must be conflict.
53:28 As long as there is division
between you and your wife
53:31 there must be conflict.
53:41 This division exists fundamentally,
53:50 as long as there is the observer
separate from the thing observed.
53:57 As long as I say,
anger is different from me,
54:03 I must control anger,
I must change anger,
54:07 I must control my thought,
I must change, do this, that,
54:13 in that there is division,
therefore there is conflict.
54:16 Conflict implies suppression,
conformity, imitation,
54:24 all that is involved in that.
54:26 If you really
see the beauty of this,
54:34 that the observer is the observed,
54:38 the two are not separate,
54:47 then you can observe the totality
of consciousness without analysis.
54:52 Then you see the whole content
of it instantly.
55:14 That is, the observer
is the thinker.
55:26 And we have given such tremendous
importance to the thinker,
55:34 haven't we?
55:37 We live by thought,
55:44 we do things by thought,
55:49 we plan our life by thought,
55:58 our action is motivated
by thought.
56:07 And thought is worshipped
throughout the world
56:12 as the most
extraordinarily important thing,
56:16 which is part of the intellect.
56:26 And thought - again,
please follow this a little bit -
56:30 thought has separated itself
as the thinker.
56:39 The thinker says, these thoughts
are no good, these are better.
56:48 He says, this ideal is better
than that ideal,
56:54 this belief is better
than that belief.
57:01 It is all the product of thought,
57:06 thought which has
made itself separate,
57:11 fragmented itself as the thinker,
as the experiencer.
57:18 Thought has separated itself as
the higher self and the lower self.
57:25 In India they call it the atman,
the higher,
57:29 here you call it the soul,
or this or that,
57:31 but it is still thought
in operation.
57:36 That's clear, isn't it?
57:39 This is logical, it is not irrational.
57:43 Now I am going to show you
the irrationality of it.
57:55 We have lived,
all our books and all our literature,
58:01 everything is this, thought.
58:08 And our relationship is based
on thought, just think of it.
58:19 My wife - I haven't got one -
58:23 my wife is the image
which I have created by thinking.
58:35 That thinking has been
put together by nagging,
58:39 you know all the things that go on
between husband and wife,
58:43 the pleasure, the sex,
the irritations, the exclusions,
58:49 all that goes on,
58:51 all the separative instincts
that go on.
58:58 And our thought
59:03 is the result
of our relationship.
59:11 And what is thought?
59:17 If you were asked that question,
what is thought?
59:22 Please don't repeat somebody else,
59:26 find out for yourself.
59:33 What is thought?
59:37 Surely thought is the response
of memory.
59:47 Memory as knowledge,
59:51 memory as experience
which has been accumulated,
59:56 stored up in the brain cells.
1:00:00 So the brain cells themselves
are the cells of memory.
1:00:12 If you didn't think at all,
you would be in a state of amnesia,
1:00:19 you wouldn't be able
to go to your house.
1:00:26 So, thought is the response
of the accumulated memory
1:00:30 as knowledge, experience,
1:00:33 whether it is yours or the inherited
or the communal and so on.
1:00:44 So thought is the response
of the past,
1:00:51 which may project itself
into the future,
1:00:55 but it is still the past
going through the present,
1:01:00 modifying it as the future.
But it's still the past.
1:01:07 Bene? Shall I go on?
1:01:12 So, thought is never free.
1:01:18 How can it be?
1:01:20 It can imagine what is freedom,
1:01:26 it can idealise
what freedom should be,
1:01:35 create a utopia of freedom,
1:01:39 but thought itself, in itself,
is of the past
1:01:45 and therefore it is not free
and it is always old.
1:01:52 Right?
1:01:57 Please, it's not a question of
your agreeing with the speaker -
1:02:02 that's a fact.
1:02:11 And thought organises our life,
1:02:18 based on the past.
1:02:23 And that thought, based on the past,
projects what should be tomorrow,
1:02:34 and so there is conflict.
1:02:43 From that arises a question,
1:02:48 which is, for most of us
1:02:53 thought has given a great deal
of pleasure.
1:03:00 Right?
1:03:04 Pleasure is a guiding principle
in our life.
1:03:13 We are not saying that
it's wrong or right,
1:03:18 we are examining it.
1:03:25 Pleasure is the thing
that we want most
1:03:31 - here in this world,
in the spiritual world,
1:03:35 in the world of heaven,
if you have a heaven - pleasure.
1:03:42 Pleasure in any form:
1:03:46 religious entertainment,
1:03:50 going to Mass, all the circus
that goes on in the name of religion,
1:03:58 and the pleasure of any incident,
1:04:05 whether it is of a sunset,
1:04:08 or any sensory pleasure,
1:04:14 is recorded and thought over.
1:04:19 Right?
1:04:23 So thought as pleasure
plays a tremendous part in our life.
1:04:35 Something happened yesterday
1:04:37 which was a lovely thing,
a most happy thing,
1:04:44 it's recorded,
1:04:46 thought comes upon it, chews it
and keeps on thinking about it
1:04:53 and wants it to be repeated again
1:04:57 sexual or otherwise.
1:05:02 And so thought gives vitality
to an incident that is over.
1:05:12 I hope you are following all this.
1:05:16 And so, the very process of recording
1:05:23 is knowledge, which is the past.
1:05:27 And thought is the past.
1:05:36 So, the thought as pleasure
is sustained.
1:05:43 And if you have noticed,
pleasure is always in the past,
1:05:51 or the imagined pleasure
of tomorrow
1:05:55 is still the recollection projected
into the future - the past.
1:06:06 And also you can also observe
that where there is pleasure
1:06:14 and the pursuit of pleasure,
1:06:17 there is also the nourishing of fear.
1:06:23 Haven't you noticed it?
1:06:29 Fear of the thing I have done
1:06:40 fear of the pain which I had,
1:06:45 physical pain, a week ago.
1:06:49 Thinking about it
sustains the fear.
1:06:58 There is no ending of that pain.
1:07:00 When it's over it is finished,
1:07:02 but I carry it over
by thinking about it.
1:07:10 So, thought sustains
and gives nourishment to pleasure
1:07:17 as well as to fear.
1:07:21 Right?
1:07:26 Thought is responsible for this.
1:07:30 I had pleasure yesterday
1:07:33 and I want it
repeated again tomorrow.
1:07:38 I have done something,
or I had pain,
1:07:44 physical pain,
1:07:45 and I mustn't have it again,
it's too awful.
1:07:49 I think about it.
1:07:55 Fear not only of the present,
of the future,
1:08:00 fear of death,
fear of the unknown
1:08:03 - oh, so many fears -
1:08:07 fear of not fulfilling,
1:08:10 fear of not being loved,
wanting to be loved,
1:08:14 all the machinery of thought.
1:08:21 So there is the rationality
of thought
1:08:24 and the irrationality of thought.
1:08:29 Are you following?
1:08:33 There must be exercise of thought
in doing things,
1:08:40 technologically, in the office,
1:08:43 when you cook,
when you wash dishes,
1:08:46 knowledge must function
1:08:52 There is the rationality,
the logic of thought
1:08:58 in action, in doing.
1:09:01 But also thought becomes
totally irrational
1:09:07 when it sustains
as pleasure or fear.
1:09:16 And yet thought says,
I cannot let go of my pleasures,
1:09:22 and yet thought knows,
if it is at all sensitive, aware,
1:09:26 that there is pain
coming with it.
1:09:33 So, to be aware of all
the machinery of thought,
1:09:38 the complicated,
subtle movement of thought.
1:09:46 And this is not difficult.
1:09:49 It really is not at all difficult
once you say,
1:09:54 I must find out a way of living
that is totally different,
1:10:02 a way of life
in which there is no conflict.
1:10:09 If that is the real demand,
1:10:14 as your demand for pleasure,
1:10:20 if that is your insistent,
passionate demand,
1:10:27 to live a life,
inwardly and outwardly,
1:10:31 in which there is no conflict
1:10:37 then you will see the possibility
of it.
1:10:42 Because we have explained
1:10:44 conflict exists only
when there is division,
1:10:49 between the me and the not me,
1:10:54 when I am a Hindu and
you are a Christian,
1:11:00 communist, socialist,
1:11:02 the racket that goes on
in this world.
1:11:08 Then if you see that,
1:11:12 not verbally or intellectually
because that's not seeing,
1:11:17 but when you actually realise
1:11:23 that there is no division between
the observer and the observed,
1:11:29 between the thinker and the thought,
1:11:33 then you see,
observe actually what is.
1:11:39 And then when you see
actually what is,
1:11:42 you have already gone beyond it,
1:11:47 you don't stay with what is.
1:11:53 You stay with what is
1:11:55 only when the observer is different
from the what is.
1:12:01 You are getting this?
1:12:09 A moment, sir.
1:12:19 I don't know what the time is,
we'll ask.
1:12:21 But just see this.
1:12:24 It's rather complex,
but quite simple really.
1:12:27 A: Could you repeat
the last part again?
1:12:32 K: Could I repeat
the last part again.
1:12:34 I don't know what I said.
1:12:42 Please don't laugh.
I'm not putting this on.
1:12:45 I've really forgotten what I said.
I'll repeat it differently.
1:12:48 I'll say it differently.
1:12:52 We have divided life
as the me and the not me,
1:12:59 we and they,
1:13:03 geographically, nationally,
religiously, family,
1:13:09 division.
1:13:13 This division takes place
inevitably, basically,
1:13:19 as long as there is the observer
different from the thing observed.
1:13:32 When I look at myself
1:13:36 as an observer different
from the thing observed,
1:13:40 then 'what is' I want to change,
1:13:44 I want to suppress it,
I want to get over it,
1:13:50 make it conform
to what I think should be,
1:13:54 the ideal which I have projected
as the observer.
1:14:03 In that there is conflict,
1:14:08 but to observe actually what is
without the observer,
1:14:14 which is the past,
which is time, all that,
1:14:19 when you so observe
actually what is,
1:14:24 the what is has undergone
a tremendous change,
1:14:29 because it's no longer what is,
what you thought what is,
1:14:33 it is something totally new.
1:14:40 I'll show it to you in a minute.
1:14:42 Need I give examples?
I'm not good at giving examples.
1:14:47 You see this, don't you?
1:14:51 We understand each other?
1:14:54 Q: May I ask a question?
1:14:58 K: Let me finish
and then you can ask.
1:14:59 I don't know what time it is.
1:15:05 What we have talked about
this evening is, very simply,
1:15:12 how to totally eliminate in oneself,
1:15:16 every form of conflict.
1:15:21 It is only then you know
what love is,
1:15:31 and this can only take place
1:15:33 when you can observe
the total content of yourself,
1:15:39 non-analytically.
1:15:42 Analysis must come into being
when there is an observer,
1:15:48 a thinker who is analysing.
1:15:52 But the thinker, the analyser,
the observer, is the analysed,
1:15:57 is the thing
that he is going to analyse,
1:16:02 is the thought.
1:16:03 So when there is this complete
1:16:10 cessation of division between
the observer and the observed,
1:16:16 then what is,
is no longer what is,
1:16:20 you have gone beyond,
the mind has gone beyond it.
1:16:27 Now proceed,
what's the question?
1:16:31 What was the question?
1:16:33 Questioner: I think I follow
what you're saying
1:16:35 about the separation between
the observer and the observed.
1:16:40 I was wondering, what do I do
when I get up in the morning,
1:16:46 realising that I observe,
1:16:49 and there is the object
that I observe
1:16:51 - I am the observer and
there's the object that I observe -
1:16:55 what do I do to change this?
1:16:58 Basically I can understand
what you are saying
1:17:00 but I don't know what to do.
1:17:02 K: I understand the question,
is this what you're saying:
1:17:05 I wake up in the morning,
1:17:09 tired, exhausted
1:17:16 - I don't know why you laugh -
1:17:22 lazy, and I observe.
1:17:29 And I don't want to get up
and do all the routine.
1:17:33 What am I to do?
Is that the question?
1:17:39 Q: That is not exactly the way
that I necessarily feel
1:17:42 when I wake up in the morning.
1:17:44 I see the separation between
wanting to observe the object
1:17:50 and yet being identified
with the situation.
1:17:53 I do not know how,
1:17:57 I don't understand
how do I change this phenomenon
1:18:01 of the observer
and the observed?
1:18:04 Can't I change it?
1:18:06 I can't just agree with you and say,
yes this is true.
1:18:10 Somehow I have to do something.
1:18:12 K: Quite right. That is,
1:18:15 there is no identification at all.
1:18:19 When you identify yourself
with the observed,
1:18:24 it is still the pattern of thought,
isn't it?
1:18:28 Q: Precisely.
How do I get out of that?
1:18:32 K: I'm going to show you.
1:18:37 You don't get out of it.
I'll show it to you in a minute.
1:18:49 Do you see the truth
1:18:54 that the observer
is the observed?
1:18:59 The truth of it, the fact of it,
the logic of it.
1:19:05 Do you see that,
the truth of it,
1:19:11 or don't you?
1:19:15 Q: It's still only a comment
which arises.
1:19:22 The truth does not exist.
1:19:24 K: The fact doesn't exist?
1:19:26 Q: No. A comment arises.
A comment of agreement arises.
1:19:30 K: Don't agree.
You see that fact, don't you?
1:19:40 Please don't agree or disagree,
1:19:43 this is a very serious thing.
1:19:46 I wish I could talk about meditation,
but not now.
1:19:52 This is implied in this.
1:19:56 Just a minute,
let me finish this.
1:19:58 See the importance of this.
1:20:07 The truth is that I am anger,
1:20:13 not I am different from anger,
1:20:18 that's the truth, isn't it?
1:20:20 That's a fact, isn't it?
1:20:24 I am anger,
not 'I' separate from anger.
1:20:31 When I am jealous,
'I' am jealous,
1:20:35 not I am different from jealousy.
1:20:40 I make myself separate
from jealousy
1:20:44 because I want to do something
about jealousy,
1:20:48 sustain it or get rid of it
or rationalise it,
1:20:51 or get bored with it,
whatever it is.
1:20:55 But the fact is,
the me is jealous.
1:21:01 That's a fact, isn't it?
1:21:07 How am I to act
when I am jealous,
1:21:15 when 'me' is jealousy?
1:21:19 Before, I thought I could act
1:21:22 when I separated myself
from jealousy,
1:21:24 I thought I could do something
about it,
1:21:26 suppress it, rationalise it,
or run away from it,
1:21:30 do various things.
1:21:31 I thought I was doing something.
1:21:35 Here, I feel I am
not doing anything.
1:21:41 That is, when I say,
I am jealousy,
1:21:47 I feel I can't move.
1:21:55 Isn't that right?
1:22:02 I'll show it to you.
1:22:07 Look at the two varieties
of activity,
1:22:13 the action which takes place
1:22:17 when you are different
from jealousy,
1:22:22 which is the non-ending
of jealousy.
1:22:28 You may run away from it,
you may suppress it,
1:22:32 you may transcend it,
you may escape, etc.,
1:22:37 but it will come back,
it will be there always,
1:22:42 because there is the division
between you and jealousy.
1:22:50 Now, there is a totally
different kind of action
1:22:54 when there is no division,
1:22:58 because in that
the observer is the observed,
1:23:04 he cannot do anything about it.
1:23:12 Before, he was able
to do something about it,
1:23:16 now he feels he is stumped,
1:23:19 he is frustrated,
he can't do anything.
1:23:28 If the observer is the observed
1:23:32 then there is no saying,
I can't do anything about it.
1:23:38 He is what he is.
1:23:43 He is jealousy.
1:23:46 Now, when he is jealousy,
what takes place?
1:23:58 Go on, sir.
1:23:59 Q: He understands something.
1:24:01 K: Look at it.
1:24:04 Do look at it for a minute,
take time.
1:24:09 When I realise
1:24:15 I am different from my jealousy,
1:24:18 then I feel I can do something
about it.
1:24:22 And in the doing of it
there is conflict.
1:24:28 Here, in the other side,
when I realise the truth of it,
1:24:35 that 'me' is jealousy,
the observer is the observed,
1:24:40 then what takes place?
1:24:41 Q: There is no conflict.
1:24:44 K: Then what takes place?
1:24:46 The element of conflict
comes to an end, doesn't it?
1:24:52 The element of conflict ceases.
1:24:57 Here conflict exists,
here conflict doesn't exist.
1:25:01 So conflict is jealousy.
1:25:08 You've got it?
1:25:18 Just see what I've said.
1:25:20 Please take time.
1:25:23 Why do you clap?
1:25:25 Q: May I ask a question?
1:25:27 K: Sir, wait a minute, please.
1:25:32 There was conflict,
1:25:35 and conflict
has been part of my life.
1:25:39 I've lived with conflict
1:25:41 from the moment I am born
until I die,
1:25:44 I know nothing but conflict.
1:25:49 Here, when the observer
is the observed,
1:25:53 the thinker is the thought,
1:25:56 then there is no conflict.
1:26:00 When there is no conflict
there is no jealousy.
1:26:07 Jealousy is conflict, isn't it?
1:26:11 Q: In a way, yes.
1:26:15 Q: May I ask a question?
1:26:17 K: Have you got this?
Q: Yes.
1:26:21 K: There has been
complete action here,
1:26:28 an action in which
there has been no effort at all,
1:26:33 therefore it is complete, total,
it will never come back.
1:26:42 Q: May I ask a question?
K: Yes.
1:26:51 K: What did you want to ask?
1:26:55 Q: You said analysis
is the deadly tool of thought,
1:26:59 or consciousness.
1:27:01 I perfectly agree with you,
and you were about to say that
1:27:06 you would develop the argument
that there are fragments in the brain,
1:27:13 or thought or consciousness
which would be anti-analytical.
1:27:18 I would grateful if you would
continue to develop that thought.
1:27:23 K: Of what?
1:27:26 Q: You mentioned that the fragments
1:27:29 would not constitute
any conflict or struggle.
1:27:33 They will be anti-analytical...
1:27:39 K: You are repeating something.
What is the question?
1:27:43 Q: I only request to continue
what you mean by fragments
1:27:48 that will be anti-analytical.
Thank you.
1:27:56 K: I just explained.
1:27:59 There must be fragmentation
1:28:02 when there is the observer and
the observed as two different things.
1:28:08 I've explained it.
1:28:11 No?
1:28:16 Look, this is not an argument.
1:28:20 This is nothing to develop.
1:28:24 I have gone into it fairly thoroughly.
1:28:28 We can of course
spend lots more time
1:28:30 because the more deeply
you go into it, the more there is.
1:28:40 We have broken up our life
into many fragments, haven't we.
1:28:45 The scientist,
the businessman, the artist,
1:28:50 the housewife and so on.
1:28:54 What is the basis
of this fragmentation,
1:28:57 what is the root
of this fragmentation?
1:29:01 The root of this fragmentation
is the observer and the observed.
1:29:07 He breaks it up,
he breaks up life.
1:29:12 I am a Hindu
and you're a Catholic,
1:29:18 I am a communist,
you are a bourgeois,
1:29:22 so there is this division
going on all the time.
1:29:26 And I say,
why is there this division?
1:29:31 What causes this division?
1:29:35 Not only the external,
economic, social structure,
1:29:40 but much more deeply,
what causes this division?
1:29:46 This division is brought about,
this fragmentation,
1:29:50 the me and the not me,
1:29:55 the me that wants to be superior,
more famous, ambitious,
1:29:59 the greater, the more,
1:30:02 and 'you', different.
1:30:07 So, the me is the observer,
1:30:12 the me is the past,
1:30:15 which divides the present
as the past and the future.
1:30:22 So, as long as there is
the observer,
1:30:26 the experiencer, the thinker,
there must be division.
1:30:34 We explained together that
1:30:38 when there is division
there is jealousy,
1:30:42 conflict with jealousy,
1:30:44 and so sustained conflict
in jealousy.
1:30:48 Where the observer is the observed,
conflict ceases,
1:30:54 and therefore jealousy ceases,
because jealousy is conflict.
1:31:03 Jealousy is conflict, isn't it?
1:31:06 Q: Is it human nature, jealousy?
1:31:15 K: Is jealousy human nature.
1:31:19 Is violence human nature?
Is greed human nature?
1:31:24 Q: I wanted to ask you
another question, if I may.
1:31:28 Am I right or wrong, according to
what you've been telling us,
1:31:32 and to put it succinctly:
1:31:39 as a man thinketh in his heart,
so is he.
1:31:42 So watch our thoughts
and profit from experience.
1:31:49 K: What?
1:31:53 I haven't quite understood
what you said.
1:32:00 What was the question?
1:32:15 Q: As a man thinketh in his heart,
so is he.
1:32:19 We should watch our thoughts,
shouldn't we,
1:32:22 and profit from our
past experience?
1:32:25 K: That's just what I was saying:
as you think, you are.
1:32:31 That's just it.
1:32:34 As you think,
what you think, you are.
1:32:41 What you think - that you are
greater than somebody else,
1:32:46 that you are inferior
to somebody else,
1:32:50 that you are perfect,
that you are not beautiful,
1:32:53 that you are angry
- what you think, you are.
1:32:58 That's simple enough, isn't it?
1:33:02 And until you find out
whether it is possible
1:33:07 to live a life where thought
has its rational function,
1:33:13 where thought becomes irrational.
1:33:20 We'll go into that tomorrow.
1:33:23 No, next weekend.
1:33:27 Q: To continue in the same vein
with the jealousy,
1:33:30 when the jealousy is me,
and me is the jealousy,
1:33:34 the conflict ends because I know
it's the jealousy and it disappears.
1:33:39 But when I listen to the noises
in the street
1:33:42 and the me is the noises
and the noises are me,
1:33:46 how can conflict end
when that noise will go on forever?
1:33:53 K: It's fairly simple.
1:33:57 The question is:
1:34:01 I walk down the street
and that noise is terrible,
1:34:07 and when I say that noise is me,
1:34:12 the noise doesn't end,
it goes on,
1:34:17 isn't that the question?
1:34:19 I don't say the noise is me.
1:34:26 I don't say the cloud is me
1:34:29 or the tree is me.
1:34:33 Why should I say the noise is me?
1:34:37 No, please don't laugh.
1:34:39 I don't know why you laugh
about this silly thing.
1:34:45 We pointed out just now
that if you observe,
1:34:51 if you say, I listen to that noise,
1:34:55 listen completely,
1:34:58 not with resistance,
1:35:04 then that noise may go on forever,
it doesn't effect you.
1:35:09 The moment you resist,
1:35:12 that is, you as separate
from the noise,
1:35:18 not identify yourself
with the noise.
1:35:22 I don't know if you see
the difference.
1:35:29 The noise goes on.
1:35:32 I either can cut myself off from it
by resisting it,
1:35:39 putting a wall between myself
and that noise,
1:35:45 then what takes place?
1:35:48 When I resist something
what takes place?
1:35:52 There's conflict,
1:35:54 isn't there?
1:35:56 Can I listen to that noise
without any resistance whatsoever?
1:36:01 Q: Yes, if you know that the noise
might stop in an hour.
1:36:05 K: No,
1:36:08 that's part of
your resistance still.
1:36:11 Q: That means that I can listen
to the noise in the street
1:36:14 for the rest of my life,
1:36:16 with the possibility
I might become deaf...
1:36:21 K: No,
1:36:23 I am saying something
entirely different.
1:36:28 We are saying, as long as there is
resistance there must be conflict.
1:36:36 Whether I resist my wife
or my husband,
1:36:41 whether I resist the noise
of the dog barking
1:36:45 or the noise in the street,
there must be conflict.
1:36:50 Now, how to listen to the noise
without conflict?
1:36:55 Not whether it will go on
1:36:58 hoping it will come to an end,
1:37:00 but how to listen to the noise
without any conflict?
1:37:06 That's what we are talking about.
1:37:08 You can listen to the noise
when the mind is completely free
1:37:15 of any form of resistance,
1:37:22 not only to the noise
but to everything in life,
1:37:28 to your husband, to your wife,
to your children,
1:37:30 to the politician, listen.
1:37:33 Therefore what takes place?
1:37:36 Your listening becomes
much more acute.
1:37:41 You become much more sensitive.
1:37:44 And therefore
noise is only a part,
1:37:49 it isn't the whole world.
1:37:53 So the very act of listening
is more important than the noise.
1:38:03 So listening becomes
the important thing
1:38:07 and not the noise.
1:38:10 I think I better stop,
it's ten past seven.