Krishnamurti Subtitles

Thought and knowledge are limited

Ojai - 14 May 1983

Public Talk 1



0:36 May one remind you, if I may,
that this is not an entertainment.
  
0:48 It’s nice to sit under trees
on a lovely morning, cool, fresh,
  
0:59 but in spite of all that, this is not
in any way to entertain you;
  
1:12 neither intellectually or emotionally
 
1:23 or to try to convince you of anything.
 
1:26 We are not doing
any kind of propaganda.
  
1:35 Nor is this a lecture,
 
1:40 as it’s commonly understood,
 
1:45 on a particular subject
 
1:48 to be informed, to be instructed.
 
1:52 It is not a lecture.
 
1:58 But together
we should look at the world as it is,
  
2:08 the whole world,
not a particular part of the world
  
2:18 or a particular group,
 
2:23 or be concerned for the moment
with our own particular problems,
  
2:32 of which we have many,
 
2:35 but to look at the whole world,
 
2:41 the whole earth
upon which human beings are living.
  
2:54 This world in which we live
 
3:00 has been broken up
into various forms of nationalities,
  
3:10 linguistic differences,
nationalistic, patriotic divisions,
  
3:25 religious divisions:
 
3:31 the Buddhist, the Hindu, the Tibetan,
 
3:35 the Muslim, the Christian;
 
3:38 and also the recent religion
of Communism, Marxism;
  
3:47 the totalitarian states
through certain parts of the world
  
3:51 where there is no liberty,
freedom to think what you like,
  
3:55 to do what you like.
 
3:59 Wars are going on
in different parts of the world.
  
4:07 Human beings are killing each other
 
4:11 for some idealistic,
nationalistic or racial division.
  
4:19 Human beings are slaughtered
by the latest machinery of war.
  
4:28 We are not judging,
 
4:31 nor looking at all this from any
prejudiced point or from any bias;
  
4:41 but we are looking at it together
to find out for ourselves
  
4:48 why this is happening: why there is
so much misery in the world,
  
4:58 so much confusion, great uncertainty.
 
5:09 And the world is becoming more
and more dangerous to live in.
  
5:17 In this part of the world
you may not have wars,
  
5:23 but you are preparing for war.
 
5:31 And in this world there are
a great many institutions,
  
5:38 foundations, organisations,
 
5:44 little groups with their
particular leaders,
  
5:51 the gurus with their absurdities;
 
5:58 each person or each group,
each community
  
6:06 is separating itself from others.
 
6:10 This is what is happening
all over the world;
  
6:16 more so in this part of the world
 
6:20 where each one wants
to do what he likes;
  
6:26 to fulfil himself, to express himself,
to assert himself.
  
6:40 There are threats of various kinds.
 
6:50 This is what is actually
going on in the world.
  
7:01 And when one looks at all this:
 
7:10 the terror, the suffering,
 
7:19 the bad management,
inefficient management of governments,
  
7:28 each country preparing,
accumulating the instruments of war,
  
7:37 perhaps helped by religions.
 
7:44 And when one looks at all this
quite objectively, without any bias,
  
7:56 one must ask,
if one is at all serious,
  
8:03 and one hopes that you are,
 
8:08 not only this morning for an hour
but this is a human problem.
  
8:20 It’s a great crisis.
 
8:25 And who is responsible for all this?
 
8:40 One can easily say that
it’s the environment, the society,
  
8:52 the mismanagement, and so on.
 
8:57 But in spite of all that, if we can
look really seriously, objectively,
  
9:11 not as Americans and Hindus
or a particular group,
  
9:19 but look at all this;
 
9:23 take a journey together
to find out for ourselves
  
9:32 without being told,
without being instructed or informed,
  
9:40 who is responsible for all these
terrible things that are going on.
  
9:48 Not only in the technological world,
 
9:54 which is becoming more
and more complex;
  
9:59 such tremendous advancement:
computer, the robots,
  
10:05 the missiles, the submarines,
all that’s what’s happening;
  
10:13 great surgery, medicine, all that.
 
10:24 Looking at all this,
one asks not only what is one to do,
  
10:38 but also, who is responsible,
who has brought this about:
  
10:48 the chaos, the confusion,
the utter misery of man.
  
11:01 And this society,
in which we all live,
  
11:10 this society is corrupt, immoral,
 
11:18 aggressive, destructive;
 
11:27 and this society has been going on
for thousands of years
  
11:32 modified or primitive;
 
11:37 but it is the same pattern
being repeated
  
11:41 thousands of years
upon thousands of years.
  
11:47 These are all facts.
 
11:49 This is not the opinion
or the judgement of the speaker.
  
12:02 So, as one must ask, and I hope
you will ask, who is responsible?
  
12:09 And what is one to do, confronted,
facing this enormous crisis,
  
12:18 if one is at all aware of this crisis?
 
12:24 Is the crisis outward, outside of us –
 
12:29 economic crisis, social crisis,
crisis of war;
  
12:39 the building of enormous armaments,
the appalling waste of all this.
  
12:52 And inwardly, psychologically,
we are also very confused.
  
13:05 There is constant conflict, struggle,
pain, anxiety and so on, inwardly.
  
13:18 And this society...
 
13:22 Please remember,
this is not a lecture;
  
13:26 we are together taking a journey
 
13:31 into the whole structure
of which mankind has created,
  
13:45 the disorder that human beings
have brought about in this world.
  
13:54 So there is misery, chaos,
confusion outwardly,
  
14:01 in the sense in society,
economically, religiously;
  
14:11 and inwardly, that is psychologically,
the psyche, the consciousness,
  
14:22 with its content is pain, beliefs,
struggle, and so on.
  
14:30 Which we’ll all go into
during these three talks here.
  
14:41 And since you have taken the trouble
to come here
  
14:53 you must ask: what are you
going to do about all this?
  
15:02 Turn to leaders? Better politicians?
 
15:11 This one isn’t good,
but the next one will be better;
  
15:15 and the next one will still better.
And so we keep this game going.
  
15:23 We have looked to various
so-called spiritual leaders,
  
15:32 the whole hierarchy
of the Christian world.
  
15:40 They are as confused,
uncertain as we are.
  
15:49 If you turn to the psychologists
or the psychotherapists,
  
15:53 they are like you and me
– confused.
  
15:59 And there are all the ideologies:
 
16:03 Communist ideologies,
Marxist ideologies,
  
16:09 the philosophical ideologies,
the ideologies of the Hindus
  
16:17 and the ideologies of those people
who have brought Hinduism here;
  
16:22 and you have your own ideologies.
 
16:25 You follow all this?
 
16:26 The whole world is fragmented,
broken up,
  
16:37 as we are broken up, driven
by various urges, reactions,
  
16:51 each one wanting to be important,
each one acting his own self-interest.
  
17:03 This is actually what is going on
in the world, wherever you go;
  
17:11 the most poverty-ridden
villages in India
  
17:19 or the most highly sophisticated
people in the West,
  
17:25 it’s the same issue,
the same problems:
  
17:33 poverty, hunger, man against man;
 
17:41 one ideology against another ideology.
 
17:45 This is the actual fact.
 
17:55 And what are we all
going to do about it all?
  
18:04 Who has been responsible?
 
18:11 Is each one of us responsible?
 
18:19 You and another, are we responsible?
 
18:28 Please, do ask this question
of yourself.
  
18:36 Please, for this morning, if you will,
be serious for an hour.
  
18:49 If you look to another
to instruct you,
  
18:54 to guide you, to tell you what to do,
 
19:00 and there are people
who will do all that,
  
19:05 and they too have not
through the centuries helped man
  
19:10 to bring about a different world:
 
19:16 neither so-called spiritual leader
 
19:19 – one doesn’t like that word
‘spiritual’, it’s an ugly word –
  
19:26 nor so-called statesmen.
 
19:33 So where will you look?
 
19:38 If you don’t look for leaders,
and all leaders are like the led,
  
19:50 and the various gurus are, like
the disciples, greedy, money-making
  
20:01 – you know all that stuff
that’s going on.
  
20:06 So, if all the leaders
in the world have failed,
  
20:13 not only in this generation
but in the past generations,
  
20:22 and in the future generations,
leaders have not helped,
  
20:32 Statesmen throughout the world
 
20:35 – if there are any, which I doubt,
at the present time,
  
20:40 they too have not brought
about a different society;
  
20:45 put an end to wars.
 
20:51 So where will you look?
 
20:54 The priests have failed,
 
20:57 organisations, institutions
have lost their meaning;
  
21:03 they have not helped:
the foundations, the little groups,
  
21:07 the little self-assertive
selfish little gatherings,
  
21:15 none of that has helped
to bring about a change in man.
  
21:23 And man has not changed,
though he has evolved
  
21:32 from the animal to the present
so-called civilised human beings;
  
21:40 during all long evolution
 
21:44 psychologically we are
still rather primitive.
  
21:50 That’s a fact.
 
21:54 So where will you look for help;
and can anyone help?
  
22:07 Please, if one may remind
you again and again,
  
22:13 this is not a lecture.
 
22:16 It is not that the speaker
is going to tell you
  
22:22 what to do or what to think,
 
22:25 but together you and the speaker
are looking at all these problems,
  
22:36 facing them, not avoiding them,
not running away.
  
22:46 And we have been trained,
educated to run away,
  
22:53 to seek some kind of comfort,
some kind of an answer from somebody.
  
22:59 The books can’t answer this question.
 
23:03 All the religious books cannot
possibly answer this question.
  
23:19 So knowing no leader of any kind,
the local or the imported,
  
23:32 the very erudite,
the philosophers, the psychologists,
  
23:38 none of them have helped man
to change himself psychologically.
  
23:47 And we are facing
a very dangerous world:
  
24:00 one ideology,
the Russian Marxist ideologies
  
24:05 facing the so-called
democratic ideologies.
  
24:17 So there is nobody you can turn to.
 
24:21 one wonders
if you really realise that.
  
24:30 Nobody on earth or in heaven
is going to help you.
  
24:37 You can pray,
and that which you pray to
  
24:43 is the creation of your own thought.
 
24:53 One wonders
if you actually face this fact;
  
25:00 or surreptitiously,
in our anxiety, in our confusion,
  
25:10 we turn to another.
 
25:17 And probably
you are all here for that;
  
25:25 if you are not curious,
 
25:31 if you are not saying,
 
25:33 ‘What is he going to talk about,
let's hear for a few minutes,
  
25:37 and if it doesn’t interest us,
we’ll get out.
  
25:40 It’s a nice morning,
let’s go out for a picnic’.
  
25:48 But one is confronted with this
very, very serious problem of life,
  
25:59 realising that there is nobody
that can help us,
  
26:05 nobody on earth,
or any outside agency.
  
26:15 God is the creation
of thought, of man,
  
26:24 out of his fear, out of his anxiety,
desire for comfort,
  
26:31 seeking somebody to help.
 
26:36 The thought has created
this so-called entity, God.
  
26:44 That’s a fact.
 
26:51 So, realising all this,
facing all this,
  
27:01 each one of us is responsible
for all this;
  
27:10 for any kind of war
that is happening in the world,
  
27:16 the war that’s going on
in Beirut, in Vietnam, and so on.
  
27:21 I believe about forty five wars
are going on now.
  
27:29 Because in ourselves
we are divided, fragmented,
  
27:38 in ourselves we are
nationalistic, patriotic.
  
27:46 Patriotism is not the love of land.
 
27:53 If you love the land,
you don’t want to destroy the land,
  
27:58 as it is being destroyed
right throughout the world.
  
28:08 Each one of us wants to fulfil,
immediately.
  
28:18 Whatever is the desire, fulfil it
– encouraged by the psychologists.
  
28:35 So, each one of us is responsible
as long as we are violent,
  
28:43 as long as we are in disorder,
 
28:51 as long as we are trying to fulfil
our own particular urges,
  
29:01 competitive, aggressive, brutal,
angry, violent – which we are.
  
29:10 Again, this is a fact.
 
29:16 As long as we are all this,
our society is going to be that.
  
29:25 So we have created this society
and nobody else.
  
29:36 And to bring about a change
in society, in the world…
  
29:44 One wonders if you really
realise what is happening.
  
29:52 If you are not too self-centred,
 
29:56 occupied with your own particular
little problems and desires, pleasures,
  
30:04 one wonders if you are really aware
 
30:07 in spite of the newspapers and so on,
aware what is happening.
  
30:20 And if you are aware,
not merely intellectually
  
30:28 observing the things
that are taking place,
  
30:37 you must be greatly concerned;
 
30:41 not only for yourselves,
 
30:45 but for your grandchildren,
children, for the future.
  
30:50 What’s the future of man?
 
30:58 These are all fundamental questions
that one must ask.
  
31:04 Not ask someone else, ask oneself.
 
31:19 So, who has been responsible?
 
31:24 And, what can each one of us do?
 
31:33 What’s our action, facing this,
not only crisis outwardly,
  
31:43 but crisis in ourselves.
 
31:55 How has all this been brought about?
 
32:05 We have evolved technologically
 
32:12 from a bullock cart to the jet
– tremendous evolution.
  
32:25 But inwardly, psychologically
we have hardly moved.
  
32:33 We are still very, very primitive.
 
32:39 So what shall we do?
 
32:49 To find out one must be
not only free to look,
  
32:58 free from all bias,
free from all conclusions;
  
33:08 the word ‘conclusion’ implies
to conclude, is to shut down.
  
33:19 We conclude a peace,
that means ending of a certain war;
  
33:28 conclude an argument,
that means to end that argument.
  
33:36 So without any conclusion,
without any bias whatsoever
  
33:45 – if that’s possible, and it is
possible if you are willing,
  
33:54 not from any
self-centred point of view.
  
34:03 If you look at all this,
 
34:11 is thought responsible for all this?
 
34:22 Thought that has created
the extraordinary world of technology,
  
34:31 the inventions,
the extraordinary communications,
  
34:41 the subtle surgeries, medicine;
 
34:50 the whole infinite movement
in the technological world,
  
34:56 thought has been responsible
for all that.
  
35:05 Right? Again, that’s a fact.
Nobody can deny it.
  
35:11 Thought also has created
nationalities, divisions,
  
35:20 and hoping in divisions
to find security.
  
35:33 You believe, if you believe, in a
particular form of religious ideology.
  
35:45 That again is the activity of thought
 
35:55 – not only political divisions
that exist in the world,
  
36:04 the religious divisions
that exist in the world,
  
36:10 the marvellous architecture,
 
36:15 the great cathedrals of the world
and the small churches,
  
36:21 and all the things that are
in the churches and the cathedrals,
  
36:25 in the temples and mosques
throughout the world,
  
36:30 are put there by thought:
the rituals, the ceremonies,
  
36:36 the costumes of the priests
when they perform;
  
36:43 all that is the result of thought.
 
36:51 Do you accept that?
 
36:57 Q: No!
K: No, I thought you wouldn’t.
  
37:06 You are thought, aren’t you?
 
37:10 You are memories, you are
remembrances, you are the past;
  
37:22 the past which is the accumulation
of experience and knowledge;
  
37:28 with your tendencies.
 
37:32 You are memories.
 
37:40 Right? A simple fact.
 
37:45 Subtle, sublimated, crooked,
 
37:59 one thought suppressing
another thought,
  
38:07 thought is utterly responsible
 
38:13 for all the things
that are going on in the world.
  
38:18 Please examine it, don’t deny it
or say it’s right or wrong.
  
38:23 Look at it. Have the patience, courage
and be serious enough to look at it.
  
38:39 It’s easy to say no or yes,
 
38:45 but to see the truth of it,
the actuality of it:
  
38:57 what you believe
is the activity of thought.
  
39:05 What your relationship with another
is the remembrance of thought.
  
39:15 So you are basically
a bundle of memories.
  
39:27 You may not like the fact,
you may reject it;
  
39:37 but that’s a fact.
 
39:39 If you had no memories of any kind,
you would be in a state of amnesia,
  
39:50 in a state of utter blankness,
vagueness, vacant.
  
40:01 This is a hard thing to face.
 
40:08 So thought is responsible
for the divisions:
  
40:17 religious, political,
personal, racial,
  
40:25 the wars that are going on
between the Jew and the Arabs,
  
40:30 between various religious groups,
 
40:36 it’s all the result of thought.
 
40:46 Do you really accept that?
 
40:52 If you do,
see the fact, see the truth of it.
  
40:59 Not a superstition,
not some exotic idea,
  
41:07 not something imposed
upon you by the speaker.
  
41:17 So if you see the truth of it,
objectively, impersonally,
  
41:24 without any bias whatsoever,
 
41:30 then the question arises:
 
41:35 can that thought be aware of itself?
 
41:40 Please listen to all this,
if you will kindly.
  
41:46 If you don’t want to listen,
it’s all right too.
  
41:55 What is one then to do with thought?
 
42:04 If – and it is a fact –
 
42:08 that thought has brought about
this disorder in the world,
  
42:15 then who is to put order in the world?
 
42:21 Who is to bring about
order in the world?
  
42:24 Or in oneself?
 
42:28 The world outside, apart from nature,
is the result of our activity:
  
42:41 our activity of thought has brought
about disorder in ourselves.
  
42:46 So the society is in disorder.
 
42:49 Unless we put order in the house,
 
42:52 there’ll be no order in society,
in our relationship.
  
42:56 That’s a fact!
 
43:00 Now, who is to put order in us?
 
43:06 Who is to bring about,
out of this disorder,
  
43:12 clear, strong, irrefutable order?
 
43:26 Is the thinker separate from thought?
 
43:36 You understand all these questions?
Are you interested in all this?
  
43:46 If you are not, why are you here?
 
43:53 Just to sit under the trees
and look at the blue sky;
  
44:02 and look at those lovely hills?
You can do that too.
  
44:11 But since you are here, and since
the speaker has come a long way,
  
44:21 we must together
understand this question
  
44:26 and find an answer for ourselves,
not to be told like children!
  
44:37 To find answer which is right,
correct, precise, true,
  
44:47 and not depend on anyone.
 
44:57 Therefore we must examine together.
 
45:04 We have separated thinker and thought.
 
45:12 The thinker is always
correcting thought
  
45:16 – have you observed it?
 
45:19 controlling it, denying it,
shaping it, putting into a mould.
  
45:28 So the thinker, we think,
is separate from thought.
  
45:37 Please, go into it slowly, I’m going
into it patiently, let’s go together;
  
45:43 it’s a long journey we are taking,
 
45:49 so if you take a long journey,
 
45:53 you must carry things lightly,
patiently, hesitantly.
  
46:03 And to take a long journey, you must
begin very near, which is you.
  
46:12 So, the question arises,
 
46:17 that there is a division
between the thinker and the thought.
  
46:28 The thinker is always
correcting thought, controlling it:
  
46:34 this is right, this is wrong,
this should be, this must not be;
  
46:40 and so there is a division
between the thinker and the thought.
  
46:49 Right? That’s clear.
 
46:52 Is that division real? Or fictitious?
 
46:59 There is no thinker without thought.
 
47:05 Is this all a little bit complex?
 
47:09 It doesn’t matter. It’s up to you.
 
47:19 There is a division
between the thinker who is the past
  
47:24 and the thought
that is taking place now.
  
47:29 And the thinker says that thought
is correct or wrong, right and so on.
  
47:35 He controls it, so there is a division
between the thinker and the thought.
  
47:43 So that is the basis
of fragmentation in us.
  
47:51 Right? Are we together in this?
At least a little bit.
  
48:02 We are asking why, in human beings,
inwardly, psychologically,
  
48:11 there is this division,
as there is division in the world:
  
48:19 the separation, this fragmentation
of human beings – Christian, Jew,
  
48:26 all the rest of it.
 
48:28 What is the root
of this fragmentation?
  
48:35 The root of it is:
 
48:38 there is a division between the two,
the thinker and the thought.
  
48:43 There is no thinker
apart from thought.
  
48:50 The thinker is the past,
so is thought.
  
48:59 Thought is the result or response
or the reaction of memory.
  
49:11 Memory is the result
or reaction of knowledge.
  
49:19 Stored in the brain,
knowledge is experience;
  
49:25 in the scientific world,
in the technological world,
  
49:29 in the world of inward world,
psychological world,
  
49:34 knowledge, experience, memory,
and the response of that is thought.
  
49:42 That’s a fact.
 
49:47 And where there is knowledge,
and knowledge is always incomplete;
  
49:59 either in the present
or the future or in the past.
  
50:05 There is no complete knowledge
about anything.
  
50:10 There can never be.
 
50:18 Even the scientists, biologists
and archaeologists and so on,
  
50:27 they do admit – knowledge is limited.
 
50:34 Where there is
limitation of knowledge,
  
50:38 there must be limitation of thought.
 
50:44 When you say, ‘I am a Christian’,
it’s limited.
  
50:50 When you are thinking
about yourself, your problems,
  
50:53 your relationship, your sexual
pleasures and fulfilment,
  
50:57 that’s very, very limited.
 
51:07 And thought is limited.
 
51:11 It can invent the limitless, but
that is still the product of thought.
  
51:22 It can invent heaven,
or hell or whatever
  
51:27 – it can invent, it is still limited.
 
51:32 So where there is limitation,
there must be fragmentation.
  
51:38 I wonder if you are
following all this?
  
51:42 Please do follow this,
because it’s your life.
  
51:55 We are talking about daily life.
 
52:00 So where there is limitation
there must be conflict.
  
52:06 When I say, ‘I am a Hindu’,
it’s limited.
  
52:14 When I say, ‘I am a Catholic’,
obviously.
  
52:26 Where there is limitation
there must be division.
  
52:31 Where there is division,
there must be disorder.
  
52:40 And we live in disorder.
 
52:46 In the old world,
there was order of some kind,
  
52:53 because they followed
certain traditions.
  
52:59 In the modern world,
tradition is thrown overboard,
  
53:05 and there is nothing left,
so you do what you want to do.
  
53:11 And each one of us in this world
 
53:14 is doing what he wants to do
– his thing.
  
53:18 And look at what chaos
it’s bringing about:
  
53:27 politically, with the lobbies,
 
53:31 each individual following
his own particular inclination,
  
53:36 religious or otherwise.
 
53:43 I wonder if one is aware of all this,
of what we are all doing.
  
53:55 The immense propaganda
that’s going on,
  
54:00 in the name of religion,
in the name of this or that.
  
54:10 So, our question then is,
 
54:16 in our relationship,
intimate or otherwise,
  
54:24 in our actual daily relationship,
there is fragmentation.
  
54:36 The wife or the girl or the boy or
the man follows his own inclinations,
  
54:42 his own desires, his own sexual
demands – you know all that.
  
54:49 There are two separate entities having
a relationship – perhaps sexual –
  
55:00 but otherwise they have
no relationship at all, actually.
  
55:07 That’s a fact.
 
55:11 Each one is pursuing his own ambition,
his own fulfilment, his own urges,
  
55:22 inclinations,
the obstinacy of each one.
  
55:31 And we call this conflict
relationship.
  
55:39 That relationship has
brought about this division,
  
55:46 which is not relationship at all.
 
55:52 You may hold the hand of another,
embrace another, walk together,
  
55:59 but inwardly you are separate
from the other.
  
56:11 That’s a fact. Do face it.
 
56:18 And so there is perpetual
conflict between the two.
  
56:29 And if one asks:
 
56:32 is it possible to live in relationship
with another without conflict?
  
56:45 The hermits, the monks,
those who live in solitude
  
56:51 whether in the great mountains
of India or in this country…
  
57:00 Relationship is
the greatest thing in life.
  
57:06 You cannot live without relationship.
 
57:14 You may withdraw
from all relationship,
  
57:19 finding that relationship is painful;
 
57:24 always living in struggle, conflict,
possessing and not possessing,
  
57:31 jealous, you know all that happens.
 
57:36 There are those who withdraw
from all relationship.
  
57:41 But they are related,
 
57:44 they cannot possibly escape
from any kind of relationship.
  
57:54 So is it possible, as it is necessary,
 
58:01 to live in relationship
without a single shadow of conflict?
  
58:12 You are asking this question,
please, not the speaker.
  
58:23 This is an important question,
a deep, fundamental question.
  
58:35 If you cannot live in relationship
with each other without conflict,
  
58:45 then you will create a world
which is full of conflict.
  
58:53 Even the quail agrees.
 
59:05 So we are asking:
 
59:09 what is the cause of this conflict,
of this disorder;
  
59:18 in ourselves, in our relationship,
 
59:21 and the disorder
that exists outside of us?
  
59:32 What is the actual fact
of relationship?
  
59:41 The fact, not romantic, you know,
all that kind of sentimental stuff,
  
59:48 but the actual fact,
the brutal fact of it.
  
59:58 Because if one doesn’t really
understand the beauty,
  
1:00:03 the depth, the vitality
and the greatness of relationship,
  
1:00:13 we do make a mess of our lives.
 
1:00:25 Is our relationship based on memory?
 
1:00:35 Is it based on remembrances?
 
1:00:41 Is it based on the past incidents
 
1:00:47 accumulated as various
images, pictures?
  
1:00:59 If it is remembrance,
if it is various images,
  
1:01:09 then all that
is the product of thought.
  
1:01:15 Then one asks is thought love?
 
1:01:26 Do please ask this question of
yourself, not that I am prompting you.
  
1:01:34 You are all grown-up people; I hope.
 
1:01:46 Is the accumulated knowledge
of each other
  
1:01:53 – which must always be limited
 
1:01:57 and therefore that very knowledge
is the root of conflict –
  
1:02:06 is that knowledge, that conflict,
is that love?
  
1:02:15 Not love of some romantic idea:
 
1:02:21 love of God, love of,
you know all that kind of stuff,
  
1:02:24 love between human beings,
a friendship,
  
1:02:31 a sense of communication,
communion, non-verbal, verbal.
  
1:02:45 So, is it possible to live
with another without a single image,
  
1:02:58 without a single remembrance
of the past
  
1:03:01 which has given you pleasure or pain?
 
1:03:06 Do think, look at it.
 
1:03:17 And is it possible not to build
images about the other?
  
1:03:30 If you do build images
about the other, which is knowledge,
  
1:03:34 then it is perpetual division.
 
1:03:41 Though you may have
children, sex, and so on,
  
1:03:45 but it’s fundamentally division.
 
1:03:49 Like the Arabs and the Jew,
the Christian and the Muslim.
  
1:03:56 So where there is division
there must be conflict.
  
1:04:00 That’s a law.
 
1:04:05 So can I, can you, can each of us
have a relationship
  
1:04:15 in which there is
no conflict whatsoever?
  
1:04:22 Yes, sir, go into it.
 
1:04:29 This is part of meditation;
 
1:04:33 not all the silly things that are
going on in the name of meditation.
  
1:04:39 This is meditation:
to find out, to probe into oneself
  
1:04:48 whether it is possible
to live with another happily,
  
1:04:58 without domination,
without suppression,
  
1:05:01 without the urge to fulfil,
all that kind of childish stuff.
  
1:05:08 To live with another
without any sense of division.
  
1:05:16 The division must exist as long
as thought is in operation,
  
1:05:23 because thought is limited;
because knowledge is limited.
  
1:05:37 And in that division
there is great pain;
  
1:05:45 anxiety, jealousy, hatred;
me first and you after.
  
1:06:04 To observe this fact, to observe,
not say, ‘I must have no division’
  
1:06:13 – that sounds silly –
 
1:06:17 to observe the fact
that you are first divided,
  
1:06:23 like two parallel lines never meeting,
except perhaps sexually.
  
1:06:31 Otherwise two separate lines,
two separate rows,
  
1:06:35 two separate railway lines
 
1:06:42 each pursuing the other, his own way;
 
1:06:46 clinging to each other.
 
1:06:51 All that brings about
great misery in one’s life.
  
1:07:04 So to observe the fact,
that you are divided;
  
1:07:14 delve deeply into the fact.
 
1:07:23 When you say my wife,
my girlfriend, or this or that,
  
1:07:30 look at the word, feel the word,
the weight of the word,
  
1:07:35 the weight of the word ‘relationship’.
 
1:07:47 To weigh the word
means to hold the word.
  
1:07:57 To observe the whole
implication of relationship;
  
1:08:05 not only human relationship,
but also the relationship with nature.
  
1:08:21 If you lose relationship with nature,
you lose relationship with man.
  
1:08:30 To observe;
to observe without any bias,
  
1:08:36 to look at it, to feel the division,
 
1:08:44 and when you so observe,
which I hope you are doing it,
  
1:08:54 when you so observe, that very
observation is like a tremendous light
  
1:09:02 put on the word ‘relationship’.
You understand?
  
1:09:11 To observe – we’ll go into it.
 
1:09:17 To watch, which means to watch without
any direction, without the word,
  
1:09:32 without any motive,
just to watch all the implications,
  
1:09:37 the content of that word
‘relationship’.
  
1:09:43 To live with that word;
even for an hour,
  
1:09:49 for ten minutes, for a day, find out!
To live with it.
  
1:09:58 To so observe, which means
give your complete attention to that.
  
1:10:06 When you attend completely, the
obstacles, the division disappears.
  
1:10:15 It’s like bringing great energy
to something that is being broken.
  
1:10:20 You understand all this?
 
1:10:26 So it is possible
 
1:10:29 – not that you should accept
what the speaker is saying;
  
1:10:33 he is not an authority –
 
1:10:37 it is possible to live
without a single conflict.
  
1:10:47 But you may live without conflict,
but the other may not.
  
1:10:54 You understand the problem?
 
1:10:58 You may have understood, gone
into the question of relationship;
  
1:11:05 shed tears, laughter, humour about it;
 
1:11:11 weighed the word, lived with the word;
 
1:11:15 you may have seen and gone into it,
 
1:11:18 and comprehended it,
seen the truth of it.
  
1:11:22 But the other may not. Right?
 
1:11:27 Your wife may not
or your husband may not,
  
1:11:29 or the girl friend may not, and so on.
 
1:11:33 Then what is your relationship
with the other?
  
1:11:38 You understand?
 
1:11:39 What is the relationship
 
1:11:41 between a very, very
intelligent man and a stupid man?
  
1:11:53 Suppose you are very intelligent,
 
1:11:56 in the ordinary sense
of that word for the moment,
  
1:11:59 which is not intelligence at all,
 
1:12:03 suppose you are very intelligent,
 
1:12:07 then what is my relationship to you?
 
1:12:11 I am dull; I am rather stupid,
I cling to my own prejudices,
  
1:12:18 obstinate, my own opinions,
and I am rather stupid,
  
1:12:23 what is your relationship to me then?
 
1:12:28 Go into it, please look at it.
You will tolerate me?
  
1:12:37 Be sympathetic with me?
Be kind to me?
  
1:12:46 That means there is
still the division.
  
1:12:50 You understand?
 
1:12:59 So when the conflict ends
– suppose you have ended it –
  
1:13:05 does it imply that there is
the sense of love in it?
  
1:13:16 We’ll talk about love later on,
or the implications of that word,
  
1:13:22 and the depth of that word,
the beauty of that word.
  
1:13:27 But, when you have that quality,
that perfume, and I haven’t,
  
1:13:40 and I am your wife or husband
or whatever it is, your father, mother
  
1:13:46 – it’s strange in this country,
 
1:13:47 the fathers and mothers
don’t count any more.
  
1:13:52 They are packed away
in some place. Right?
  
1:13:58 Sent to old women’s home
or men's home.
  
1:14:06 Go to Asia, where there
is no Social Security,
  
1:14:14 the father and the mother
live with their children.
  
1:14:19 And that’s why they say,
we must have children.
  
1:14:23 That’s one of the reasons why
population is growing so tremendously.
  
1:14:33 There must be a boy,
 
1:14:34 a boy especially,
because when the parents are old,
  
1:14:39 the boys, the children
will look after them.
  
1:14:44 Here, all that’s gone.
 
1:14:53 Please consider all this when you talk
about relationship with nature;
  
1:15:07 how we are destroying the world,
 
1:15:11 polluting the world, the air,
the earth, the sea;
  
1:15:16 destroying the beauty of the earth.
 
1:15:22 And the beauty of relationship,
 
1:15:29 to live completely at peace
with one another.
  
1:15:39 Talking about peace,
can there be peace in this world?
  
1:15:48 Not in heaven, that’s an old,
old traditional disease.
  
1:16:03 Can there be peace
between human beings,
  
1:16:07 whatever their colour, their race,
 
1:16:09 their language,
their so-called culture?
  
1:16:15 And to find that peace, there must be
peace between you and another,
  
1:16:24 between you,
your wife, your children.
  
1:16:27 You understand? Can there be peace?
 
1:16:33 Which means no conflict.
 
1:16:44 Where there is no conflict,
 
1:16:46 there is something far greater
than the activity of thought.
  
1:16:56 That’s an actual fact,
 
1:17:00 if one comes to the truth
that to live without conflict...
  
1:17:06 Which doesn’t mean you become
lazy, a vegetable; on the contrary.
  
1:17:15 You have tremendous energy.
 
1:17:19 Not to do more mischief,
but to live rightly.
  
1:17:31 What is the time, sir?
 
1:17:32 Q: One-ten.
K: I am sorry I’ve kept you so long.
  
1:17:47 May I get up please?